Story Flow (Shitpost #1) + Works Well vs Doesn't Work Well (Shitpost #2)

So I find a lot of the time nowadays I just have a sense for the direction a story is going to take. I guess you could say it falls into the normal tropes and cliches for the genre. Thing is, I don't usually find it all that disappointing even if it does, I mean that kind of means that my expectations were met. On the other hand there are also times where they aren't but in a good way. Like expecting someone to live, and while you like the character and it sucks to see them die, it just works. Then there are the rage-quit times where things flop on their head and it just doesn't work. So what do you think? Do you prefer it when the story flows the way you expect it to or do you prefer it betray your expectations?

The other post that got linked for being too similar so Qidian could continue to dominate the front page of novels general.

 

Too predictable can result in boring, too "unexpected" can result in story not making sense.
so somewhere in between.

 

I don't like a story that is too predictable. But then when the story jumps around into unpredictable ways TOO much, it just throws me off. Sometimes, I like a good cliche story just add your own original twist to it and I'm satisfied. I just need that 2% brilliant originality.

 

Most novel masterpieces have some element of surprise and unpredictability, thus making the reader more pumped up and excited to guess what is going to happen next

Examples:
Game of Thrones (Probably the most unpredictable novel I've ever read)
Lord of the Rings (Boromir.. nuff said)
Dungeon Defense
Ouroboros Record

 

A story can't betray your expectations when you have none.

 

So some times story work well and sometimes the don't even when they share similar elements. Take VR novels for example. My personal opinion is that they work better when they focus more on adventure and character development than on say action. I don't mean to say that action is entirely unimportant but that when all you are doing is reading a series of fight sequences it just burns you out, because it's almost always the same thing. So for me I tend to like VR novels more the more they focus on things like crafting, or lore, or character interactions. Then I thought about summoned/reincarnation novels and how while they are at times entertaining, for the most part they aren't as engaging or interesting as novels that are just straight up fantasy as you never really lose that sense of the main character being someone you are supposed to insert yourself into. I'm sure there are more things that work and don't work. I'm sure there are lovers of modern wuxia/xuanhuan/xianxias, just as I am sure there are those that hate them. So what floats your boat, what get's your goat?

 

I have the ability to see the stream of general event..... So i like to find surprise (which is rare)

 

I just think that it is okay, as long as there is a somewhat logical progression from a to b, when looking back on the events.

 

i'm fine with mixing things up, but there comes a time when you've gotta think to yourself "just where the hell do these guys keep coming from, why did this guy turn into a total wuss for no apparent reason, and how is having this nearly random/unknown character talk about how smart and awesome and calculating they are despite having no actual reason or ability to do any of the things they've done a good idea?"

most "surprises" are usually left field styled "what-a-twit" moments by the author trying to be sneaky cause the readers were already one step ahead of him on the plot and they don't wanna seem predictable rather than a proper and well thought out twist that after actually connecting the dots would make sense. things like "all these totally unrelated events that i have zero reason for knowing about much less actually putting into action were only part of my master plan to.... um.... *plot*... yes, that's right. my master plan to *plot* you in your face." just kinda ruin things for me.

 

That is incredibly zen. Complete bullshit in my opinion, but very zen nonetheless. Of course I'm probably being overly technical when I assume it's impossible to truly have no expectations. I mean a story is a clearly defined thing, so you can't have absolutely no expectations.

 

Surprises are one of the keys to make a story memorable. Done right, they can trigger a myriad of emotional responses and provoke thought, plus they keep the story interesting.. so yes, I love me a well made and placed surprise.

Well made, because making a surprise just for the sake of surprising your audience can be shallow, thus less impactful. Doesn't mean they shouldn't occur, just make sure they're well placed. Best when the surprise is actually entwined to plot/character development.
Too many surprises can end up numbing,.

 

the line between a genius and a fool is a thin one. what one mistakes as madness can be extreme clarity, and what you feel is right can be wrong.

A story is made to entertain. a long as it does it i'm fine.

 

As others have said, its a mix of both. The story should be predictable at some sense while offer surprises in other sense. But it needs to be planned surprises and not forced. I hate it when authors on purpose try to twist the story even as far as breaking their own plot to try to get a surprise in. The best kind of surprises are the ones that give hints.

Of course there is a risk of the readers finding out, but so what? That is the whole point, some surprises get predicted others get to live on. And those that live on are the ones that really surprise people the best. The flow should be natural.

 

i think they get more caught up in the numbers when it really means nothing. reading nothing but ####### damage with ________ with a few barrel rolls and dirty jokes thrown in for multiple chapters in a row isn't really a story. most of it is basically all the stuff that goes into the combat tab nobody actually looks at unless they're dead and wanna see what killed them, or they're tryin to min-max/parse their damage. most of the time, i'm more interested in what's goin on in the RL of a story because it feels like people are actually doin something plot relevant instead of constantly hearing about how great a piece of armor is that they'll outgrow in about 5 chapters (more if they drag out a boss fight).

the more daily life styled things are a bit better, but it gets old constantly reading multiple chapters in a row about all the crafting, that they'll never really do anything with, every time they get back from having an "adventure"

 

I prefer it when they don't follow my expectations, but I don't mind it if I can predict the story.

Both are okay for me.

 

Isn't it supposed to be genius and insanity? Either way I have this theory that still works regardless of which. Basically the idea is that genuises and insane people, or fools if you want, experience a different reality, or maybe experience reality differently work better, than the common individual. So when you ask someone "Are you the type of person to think inside the box or outside of the box?" The common person will answer "Inside." or "Outside." but the geniuses, fools and madmen will cock their heads sideways and ask "What box?"

But more on topic I completely agree, that the most important thing for a story is to be entertaining.

 

... I don't think they are that similar though. One is about the types of stories and story elements that work and don't work for us and the other is about whether we like to be surprised, positively or negatively, by stories. I mean they both involve preference but it's still two different things. Two different issues. I mean one I can easily make a poll on, the other I can't because it requires an actually response with some meat on it.

 

There should be foreshadowing if you want a surprise to work. It should be unexpected but not totally out of the blue. Even if the hints aren't obvious,they should be there. Such that the reader goes ohhhhh... that's why that was like that!

 

That's incredibly hard to do, but amazing when it works out.