LCD Tsuki ga Michibiku Isekai Douchuu

Discussion in 'Latest Chapter Discussion' started by Parth37955, Jan 7, 2016.

  1. Lazy King

    Lazy King Well-Known Member

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    Anyone have a feeling Pione is partially charmed considering the charm perfume Tomoki has spread around.
    Even Pione knows that her directed hatred towards Raidou is unreasonable. Yet nothing is being directed towards Tomoki. I am not saying she shouldn't have any hatred towards Raidou but when there are two targets of hatred and one for mysterious reasons disappears that hatred has to be directed somewhere else.
    When Makoto and the white knight faced off they both noted that they had their trump cards prepared and both had to spend time preparing it. If Garden's preparation was waiting for his arrival then was Kuzonoha preparation finding and curing charm using Sekai?
     
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  2. Avil

    Avil Well-Known Member

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    Makoto has been showed as a gray-zone character at best but I fail to see what he did wrong this time, someone tried to kill him he killed them and that's it.I understand Pione is not going to accept it at an emotional level, imagine if Makoto had no combat strength and those girls killed him, will Pione hand her friends to the soldier for their crimes? No she was hellbent on protecting them and nothing else mattered.
    P.S. The adventurers were trying to kill Makoto and his servants so you can get the idea they are completely ignoring their shortcomings in this matter.
     
    Last edited: Sep 21, 2017
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  3. Lazy King

    Lazy King Well-Known Member

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    Pione's hate is not unreasonable. What is unreasonable is the amount. I hypothesize she is partially charmed with perfume and all hate directed towards Tomoki is being misplaced somewhere else. And the trump card Kuzonoha has spent time preparing is spreading Sekai to find who has been partially charmed so that although the hate can not be removed, it can be lessened
     
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  4. NekoMK2

    NekoMK2 Lazy cat, [self proclaimed GM_Rusaku Disciples]

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    interesting hypothesis and yeah I agree @Lazy King said about the anger, at this point we didn't know how deep they relation is (pione and her friend) as for reverse psychology you said, the drama will still roll like this but with different scenarios the Kuzunoha will be one who Invade and wreack havoc, see this applies to them too, one of them got killed isn't it reasonable for them to angry (although not really one of them ) I didn't said Makoto complete guilty but he also not really innocent here, didn't I already said this not something so easy that Makoto just asking sorry like someone accidentally bump into you, in first place is Makoto even feel sorry about killing those 3 ? also the way they go here like they said "okay I will accept you anger but not expect we will stay down but we will hit you down instead" seriously I kinda wondering is he expecting for them willingly hear what he say with that kind of attitude ? isn't he came for negotiation? oh well I didn't have problem with how gray Makoto is, but his personality growth who seriously like not growth kinda let down here
     
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  5. defry

    defry Well-Known Member

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    Mental ilness is the most ignored issue world wide, so using that as an example is bad. I have seen a person hiding his illness and no one he had mental issues, he was left to babysit his younger twin brother that were 5 and then after so many times he baby sit them, he stabs them multiple times or a father, all of the sudden kill his family and then himself with no known problems before.

    I think that, if someone has a mental illness or a mental issue... he or she has the right to choose to defend himself. Makoto could have been a martyr and take it, or capture that person (he was so OP he could have captured them) but you cannot force someone who has to defend himself, tell him how to defend himself.... the moment a person was attacked with the intent to kill, he has to do what makes him feel safe. Of course, it would wrong that after you capture the person you kill him/her... it is no longer self-defence but just revenge or rogue vigilante.
     
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  6. Fluffums

    Fluffums 【R-18 Researcher】【Seeker of Moe】

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    Makoto had no need to kill her. She had no chance of being able to harm him or those around him. Now that he's shown how strong he is (and his ability to defeat really strong people without really harming them...) it should be even harder to convince Pione that her friend's death couldn't be helped. We'll see how it goes, I guess.
     
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  7. Avil

    Avil Well-Known Member

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    I used mental illness to highlight those girls were not attacking out of their own volition, sorry if I offended you.
     
  8. CountryMage

    CountryMage [XSanguine8] not my blood...

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    Pione is also an assassin class, she already knows mentally, that you are screwed if they detect you. Her friends got caught in the act, and it wasn't just a training exercise.
     
  9. defry

    defry Well-Known Member

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    My bad, I got a little to sensitive. It is really depressing how massive and ignored is mental illness world wide.

    I do get your point but people who attack or do things because of a mental illness.... they do it of their own will but that will is warped by the mental illness or influenced by it. So, his will is there but it cannot be called really a will because there is a serious lack of rationale or awareness. So, an attack of mental illness has a will but it is warped, confused or lack of rationale, self-awareness or awareness of the surroundings or others.

    I think that it is interesting how the author will portray mind control. Mind control in this novel is different... it does give reasoning for their attack or actions and their reasoning is "love". Even if that love is fake and their reasoning is fake. Compared to a person with mental issues... he will find it hard to rationalize or do actions that require some certain amount of logic, whereby a mind controlled person in this novel can and has logic, even though it is crap logic but it is still there.
     
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  10. CountryMage

    CountryMage [XSanguine8] not my blood...

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    The reasoning is real, the problem is that the "love" is so great, that it replaces all other needs. Tomoki is their world, they do everything in their power to support him and further his plans. Sound reasoning from a very faulty foundation.
     
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  11. Paps

    Paps Well-Known Member

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    Well I hope that after this pause someone manages to make her notice that she is completely ignoring the reason fro her friend been brainwashed and attacking Makoto, as Lazy King mentioned is really weird how little mention has been show the fact the she was brainwashed.
     
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  12. defry

    defry Well-Known Member

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    They stated they had some plan to remove that brainwashing. I assume it is related to their guild or adventurer skill... they had multiple and various skills, so it may be plausible that it could have been possible.

    Yet, I believe that since the dweeb upgraded his brainwashing skills.... it is nearly impossible to remove them, that's what Makoto seemed to think and I believe that, cause he has this mind reading skill that he does on an unconscious level, where he looks at what type of person one is. Kinda like Tomoe but he does on an unconscious level, kinda like a instinct.
    I also think Makoto could have cured her if he invested a lot of time and resources but he cannot be bothered for someone he is indifferent to.
     
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  13. Paps

    Paps Well-Known Member

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    Well Makoto never stated that he could have cured her, but he did said that the reason he considered it was to late to save her and other people that have been brainwashed was because the action they had made while under the influence was so foreign to their original self that it would be worse for them if cured (or something like that) like for example the mother of his student fiance that has been killing her husband and openly involving herself with another man with out a care for consequances.
     
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  14. Masukure

    Masukure Well-Known Member

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    Its been stated that once those under the influence of the charm start acting independently for trashmoki's sake without him having to give them orders its too late. They cannot distinguish their real feelings from what the charm made them feel. Also even short term, its like a drug, it gives them pleasure and is very addictive. Even if it is removed before they've completely lost themselves, they may go back for more.
     
  15. Paps

    Paps Well-Known Member

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    When has sucha thing been stated, I don't remember, please put a link if posible. I remember that he was thinking about the incident with the girl and rememberd that uncociously he readed her memmory and saw how mutch the actions she has taken since been charmed difered from her original personality, and that was why he stated that it was to late for her, diferent from Sofia(?) the number one ranked adventure that when she got charmed her actions didn't deviate from her original self.
     
  16. Masukure

    Masukure Well-Known Member

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    Its been awhile since so I can't exactly remember when it said it. I might trying looking through some chapters. Maybe when he visited the empire?
     
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  17. CountryMage

    CountryMage [XSanguine8] not my blood...

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    I don't know about the pleasure coming from the charm, or whatever, but Sofia was only barely charmed, her will was too strong for the full effect. In Sofia's case, it was enough for her to leave Tomoki alive though, his blessing wouldn't have worked forever, and she even planned to see him again later. She found him boring for the first half of the fight, and by the time she detected Raidou, she was saying that Tomoki was an interesting fighter.
     
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  18. Paps

    Paps Well-Known Member

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    Even so she didn't change her behavior when she got charmed, as you said she barely got charmed but didn't act out of character because of it, now in Makoto eyes people who change their behavior radically after guetting charmed tend to be a lost case to cure because they acted completely different that their usual selfs would do, but I think this is more on the line of the morality of their actions once they guet charmed, like been hypnotisided to blow a bomb when one is opposed to the use of weaponery.
     
  19. CountryMage

    CountryMage [XSanguine8] not my blood...

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    It goes by levels, Sofia was only partially charmed, her will was still there, but Tomoki was getting more interesting to her as time went on. Fully charmed people lose their will at first, only doing as he says, but they begin to follow him of their own "will" after it seeps in enough. Sofia did get even angrier when the charm residue was removed, though.
     
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  20. SquirFail

    SquirFail The One Who Forgets, Dreamer, Observer

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    Yes Tomoki's charm powers did level up, but its not impossible to remove them like Makoto said it can be removed but those people when high sense of justice/pride might not be able to live with the things they did under the charm and even though the charm can be removed the victim cant/will have a hard time distinguishing fact from fiction
     
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