Spoiler Latest Chapter Discussion Thread for Death Mage Raws

To be honest, I think the IRL comparisons can be both a distraction and a useful reference.

The situation here on Lambda is very much it's own thing. Yet, there is a certain amount of "convergent evolution" as it were - that things happen like this due to a particular combination of circumstances and while each is its own beast, there is a lot of overlap too. One of the more unusual aspects here is the big gap between the leaders and the rest - the gods are clearly setting the agenda, but there's a lot of autonomy outside of certain limits. So countries come and go. There's wars and all sorts. The sort of things you might see in a more normal "fantasy" setting. Except, religion has a huge impact on certain people on the world, as our MC finds very quickly.

Thinking about the initial setting, it would actually be very hard for someone on the ground to make a big impact even if they were very strong. After all, mortals can't reach the divine realm. Vida or those gods aligned with her couldn't raise new gods. Because Alda and co are someone detached from things on the ground, it's actually quite hard to build up motivation to "rebel" against Alda. After all, if you believe in Alda's gods you get power. If you try another god you don't... with some exceptions (mostly the evil gods). It's probably because of all this that there's historically been very little for resentment for Alda on the ground. He didn't need to be good at managing the population as they largely did that themselves. Effectively the situation was "if you believe in me I'll give you power" and since his teachings largely promoted stability and not much else, those in power on the ground had basically no real reason to turn their back on Alda.

So while it does make sense how the world could basically stagnate for 100,000 years it was also incredibly vulnerable to certain sorts of attacks. Because Alda took quite a hands off approach to those on the ground, it would be hard for him to stop a cultural attack. ie what Van's doing now in the Orbaume Kingdom is the ultimate weakness of Alda's side. In theory, Van could actually win without strength, though it would be very hard and probably take a long time. For example, slowly undermine the Amid Empire so that it collapses. Slowly sow bad examples of Alda believers so that fewer people trust him. Slowly prepare acceptable alternatives so that normal people don't need to rely upon adventurers (who would typically be Alda believers). Slowly undermine the church using corruption and exposing that corruption. Basically, slowly starve Alda and his gods of power. Considering that Van would have lived for 1000s of years naturally, he could have actually implemented a very long term plan to do this, if he'd known enough about the world at the start. Probably the biggest weakness of this plan is that the weaker Alda got the more aggressive the truly evil gods would have gotten, which wouldn't have actually been an improvement. Though if Alda's side genuinely became very weak then the Vida aligned gods within the boundary mountain range could have dropped the barrier and began to make moves and it's them that would have to counter the evil gods. I dunno what would have happened to Alda's seals on Vida if he became very weak - would they have eventually faded?

 

Van's cultural atack is strong, but without using brutality, or SEVERE brainwashing, he can take over max 70% of population or so. However it is possible to completelly remove Alda's fundamentalists, if he makes peace with pacyfists. In "you do as I say, and I let you stay" kind of way.

 

That's a great way to put it.

 

I don't think anyone will have any theories at the moment but... any theories?

 

Only a little scenario I flipped over in my head recently, the most quick and efficient way for Van to undo all the damage in Origin and restore it to a peaceful state.

Scenario: Van descends on Origin in his full Lovecraftian soul form. He makes an announcement. "I want all of the Bravers to appear in front of me within 48 hours. If you do not, I will destroy every country that engages in death magic research. If my instructions are carried out, I will grantee the lives of the Bravers and the Media but nobody else."

Van then uses [golem creation] in order to make a safe bunker for the media out of dark copper.

Bravers arrive.

Van: Alright. Well then, as for why you are gathered here. The reason is to prove one thing. You cannot beat me. I would like to verify this right now. We are going to have a quick match here. I will give you 1 minute. During that 1 minute, I will not attack or move from this spot. Your 1 minute starts now.

Amemiya: What will happen after 1 minute?

Van: I will subdue each and every one of you. My attacks will be non-lethal. You do not have to worry the same when you are attacking me though. By the way, this is only if you follow my instructions. Part of my instructions that grantee your lives and the existence of the nations researching the death attribute are for you to attack me right now.

The bravers are confused for a while, they argue for a good 15 of their 60 seconds, and then finally somebody launches a magic attack against Van which is prevented by his magic absorption barrier. Eventually, more of them start launching attacks. The only attacks that actually get through Van's barrier are the ones launched by Amemiya, but the damage is minimal and Van heals from these attacks almost instantly. Eventually, a minute passes.

Van: Well then, time is up. It looks like it's my turn now. There are 80 of you, so, I will produce 80 copies of my spirit. (NOTE: I forget the actual number of bravers remaining on Origin, but I am pulling the number 80 out of my ass for this scenario)

80 spirit clones of Van that look like his physical body looks materialize in front of the gigantic Vandaleu soul form in an 8 X 10 formation hovering in the air. They begin dropping to the ground with the lowest rank of 8 dropping a little before the rank above it, and by the time the 2nd rank hits the ground, the 1st rank has already taken off running. They use a veriety of techniques, some of which involve injuring the target, some of which involve injecting them with sleeping poisons from his claws, and others involve just taking them down with police holds. The ones who injure their targets though immediately heal them.

Van: Now then, I think this proves my point.

Van releases them all from the hold, and the spirit clones immediately dematerialize, vanishing so far as the Bravers know. 1 remains though and walks to the front as the representative.

Van: Now then, I will inform you of what this is all about. I am the one who was known as "the undead" in this world. I wanted to make it clear, none of you can defeat me as I am now, and I will not let my guard down against you this time. That in mind, I have come with a message. I want all countries to ban all research on the death attribute. They have 2 weeks to work out the writing of the bills that will ban the research, and then another 2 weeks after that to implement it. It is my understanding a previous effort to ban research on the death attribute was made, but there was a contention about rival countries continuing to research it and getting ahead of them that caused this effort to fail. Well, in this instance, I will be the enforcer behind this complete ban. If there are any countries that refuse to ban research on the death attribute, or any who say they will ban it but secretly continue to research it behind the scenes, those governments will be forcibly removed.

After this, he asks metamorph to come forward. There is some confusion since, so far as they all know, metamorph is dead, but then Rokudo steps forward and then turns into metamorph and tells everyone about how Rokudo was pulling the strings behind all the countries in regards to death attribute research. (During the earlier scuffle, he will have completely removed the brainwashing from Metamorph disguised as Rokudo and communicated his intentions to her.)

 

I would see it other way:

1. Van creates a network of info from the gifted
2. Uses druid to change it into a cult, and using pictures spreads guidance
3. With guidance and protection demon spirit descent is tought through druid
4. Some crisis happends
5. Van comes with real soul
6. Creates dungeon to teleport his body, because since dungeons normally create bodies they should help with adapting
7. Tahes legion and 3 former Braves to mess with people's heads
8. Finds the culprits and infest them with hhis brain or makes them zombies
9. Use that facility to take over other facilities, and sell Vidal products, as research of death magic
10. Threaten all "non necessary to remove death magic researches" or hire
11. Instead of forbiding, monopolize it
12. Mob countries to enforce strict rules to ensure that no nobody fucks over planet
13. When countries discover him - "if you wanna death atribute keep quiet"

 

Are you guys sure that Rodcorte used dead bodies for reincarnation in full body? I always assumed that he used the same mechanic as Devil's Nest/Dungeon monster spawn...
Wishlist for school arc:
Heinz comes to Van's school as a teacher to not be killed and talk.

 

Rodcort creates an adult body that they are reincarnated in.

 

Just to add one thing, while Bellwood is not a threat by himself anymore, as long as he is offering his full power to someone, and that someone uses it in "stupid" ways, he is still a threat, either to Van if Heinz continues with his "As long as you are using the power of the Demon King, we can't trust you" or to Alda if Heinz's mind breaks from Edgar's situation.

Let's see what we have on all influential characters in the story.

Pretty much, Alda has great expectations on Heinz, but he may be betrayed by them.

Rod can only watch right now, no dead bravers in the foreseen future unless our old hypothesis like Avalon killing Mei parents, or Ban/Mari killing Avalon, which should start once Avalon takes the first step. Though I guess Mari shouldn't take long to break from her current shell.

Alchem is fine as it is right now, and should grow more prosper with the friendship relationship with the local Vida races. I think it was suggested that they could use the local centaurs and harpies for local services, not only war related, but also to transport goods and relay messages. This should make Alchem prosper much more.

Van will start school in a few months, so until then, he may visit another dukedom to sell his religion.

I'm not sure about Marsh-kun current situation, but the new pope is already active as Alda's puppet, but considering Alda's current situation, there is nothing much to ask the pope to do that they are not already doing themselves by training heroes.

Urd can't do anything about her father, but if we are looking at a short arc until school starts, I would expect something short here, though I see no reason for Van to start anything in this place, unless Urz urges her father to do it, though with his personality, and her as a 5yo child... Maybe in a few more years, she uses her power to find something new about the past with Talosheim, and offers that information to Van as part of negotiations.

Sauron dukedom... They tried to call Darcia and Van and regretted once they found out they had relationships with the Scylla.

Talosheim, I guess even with Alchem as allies, will remain closed to the world for some time, they don't need to open a path that enemies can abuse anyway, specially with Bellwood out now.

Alchem's success may led to the curiosity of other dukedoms around about their recent changes, leading to Van and Darcia being called to other places to spread Vida religion in a faster and more effective way, as they are necessary to mediate things with the local Vida races. With Alda's camp down and Vida's faction overflowing with friendly gods, there is no better time than now for increased damage.

Thanks to Heinz being friendly towards Vida religion, Vida can spy on them and send oracles to Van, so a surprise attack should be almost impossible, so technically, Van should be able to control when and where he wants to meet Heinz, though, we don't know the effects of his Enemy of Vida titles, Heinz should not attack innocent people anymore, and will most likely ignore any infringements towards him done by Vida races.

The Vampires are no more.

Mirg Shield Nation... Nobody relevant there anymore, though maybe Van could visit his old home though. (I guess reading the manga got me in this mood) He may even find out that merchant he saved before, he was friendly, even though he told the enemy about Van later on.

Talosheim should be preparing its defenses at maximum alert, maybe more people will decide to start training to get stronger for when the likes of Bellwood attacks.

Am I missing anyone else?

 

I think it's relatively unlikely but perhaps Van will try again to get rid of his curses from Rodcorte. Might the God Destroyer job help?

Reasoning: from Van's point of view, Heinz/Bellwood is an imminent and real threat. So gaining as much power as possible before there's any actual combat would be reasonable. I dunno how practical it will be to get rid of the curses though. I don't know if there's a way for Van to target the individual curses either - the most useful thing for him would be to get rid of the curse that lets him gain exp independently.

Either way, my general impression is that Van will stick around the Demon King Continent for a while, basically helping to clear up all the monsters there. His son is looking forwards to eating them at least. I don't think cleaning up the entire continent will be the work of a few months though. But it should be good for levelling.


Incidentally, I went back and checked the current season. It's actually winter now - the big battle of this arc started in winter. The story went from autumn to winter in one chapter. It's not been stated how far away spring is in-world but it might be more like 3 months. I don't believe the author has explicitly stated what the next arc will be about yet. But both the "school arc" and Origin battle arc are imminent.

 

Newbie question:
Since author says today will be next chapter, that means when will it really appear? (In time from now/answer, since I am probably in a diffrent timezone than most of You).

 

Next chapter is due on the 29th. It's not yet the 29th in Japan (2 and a bit hours to go).

But a day is 24 hours. The author used to post most often in the morning (Japan time) but recently it's been getting later. So, safe answer would be to expect the next chapter somewhere between 10 hours from now and 26 hours from now.

 

Before hand I would guess at around 0300-0400 Zulu time but idk anymore as last chapter was closer to 1300 zulu

 

Hmm its not theory but i think the reason alda stacking SOL (stake of law) very brutal to Evil God of Chained Sin because its related to his Goal , restore Lambda before Demon King Invassion . Evil God of Chained Sin become Lambda God seem sore of eye for alda and slap on face to him i guess

 

I will playing Honkai Impact 3 so i will have little time to this thread , bye bye

 

79, Though only 78 would show It is listed on the first page.

 

My likes finally caught up!

Inherently weak governments are like buildings with weak foundations. They are easy to topple because of their inherent flaws. Communism is one such inherently weak system.

Corrupt governments are like buildings with eroded foundations. They are so poorly maintained that external factors can bend and break them from the inside.

Totalitarian dictatorships are like skyscrapers with shallow balsa foundations, combining both of the above. The building is ridiculously high-maintenance (needs propaganda) because it is always at risk of toppling under its own weight, and a termite colony (resistance and civil unrest) is all it takes to do lots of damage.

I hope that's a good analogy. I like making good analogies.

I shall stick this in my nested spoiler hall of fame!

I like how Van has to be creative about holding back. Most of the Bravers would die from a single Death Bullet, after all.

He let his guard down because he wanted to talk to them, not because he lacked the combat ability. Maybe he could have explained that? Not that it's immediately relevant to the current situation.

Van isn't explaining why he wants to ban death attribute research. This couldn't be more misleading because Van believes research is progressive and therefore good. The real problems are the inhumane methods used by researchers and the governments' push toward making WMDs. Van should make this perfectly clear.

A cult might attract unnecessary attention, but I love the idea of an Origin cult. It would actually be the first cult on that world born from a god, rather than vice versa. Maybe in addition to the standard divine protection + familiar spirit + holy items package, Van can grant special powers to various individuals, sort of like Rodcorte and Scion and Yhwach.

Great ideas, but the research facilities answer to and are funded by national governments. Van could anger many countries by taking control of their research facilities.

Mar'k is currently exiled under pretense of being unfit to rule. Most people probably think he has fallen ill or something. He is also watched and protected so he can't escape, kill himself, contact the outside world, make plans, or otherwise do anything useful.

Talosheim's military is already the most capable national combat force in the world. They are prepared for any threat short of Heinz and Bellwood themselves. The most Van can do on such short notice is improve himself and toughen up Talosheim's outer walls.

Asagi's group. I'm not sure how they'll be relevant in future conflicts, but they must be relevant somehow...

The no independent experience curse can definitely wait for later. However, the other curses are a huge problem should Van ever die. Van doesn't know how to remove or cure curses that affect the soul, but it should be possible with the death attribute, which Van has used to inflict curses and manipulate souls. I recommend Van to take a job related to soul modification or curse manipulation, if one is available.

It will help Van destroy affected soul fragments, but this is both tedious and harmful, and Van has already decided that this method isn't really worth his time and effort.

I strongly disagree; Van clearly never needed to gain experience independently. Removing the no past experience curse is the highest priority. And since all the curses are harmful, removing even one of them would be great, no matter which one it is. That said, it would be nice if Van could get rid of one curse at a time, because that could decrease the time he needs to remove each individual curse.

 

@hillo315 I have to disagree with you on the curse thing.

If I remember correctly when van was reforming his soul after the Heinz fight he had the option of getting rid of his curses but turned it down (maybe due to the demerits out saying the merits) don't forget that most of his mana comes from the empty spaces the curses make in his soul.

 

Actually he decided to remove as much "blackness" as he could without causing severe damage to soul (when removing blackness, the soul's meat is removed to, its like removing rust by cutting it off), but if didn't remove any of the curses.

No past expirience does nothing now, he regained all the power he had and way way more. That past expiriences would be now like a drop in the see (curse locks only skills, and only thing usefull from his past life is death magic LV5~10)
Independent EXP is good since he shouldn't get anything is he HollowCannons somesthing, except for soul eating bonuses, and he can not leave it to his subbordinates if he wants to eat soul (although he can catch it later if it isn't protected), so he only gets full benefits with Dead Spirit Magic - what for some reason counts in a verry helpfull way.

 

He turned down the chance because, as I said, it would take too much time and effort. Van would also have to divide his soul into even smaller pieces, which is probably bad. He did slightly weaken the curses, though.

It might not do anything now, but if Van dies, he has to catch up to 12 years of lost progress. If not for this curse, Van would hypothetically be able to freely cheat death.