WuxiaNation drops The Dark King + Madsnail's commentary

what was that? I clicked to it and it said error.

 

Some troll made obscene post. The post and the account is gone now.

 

ooh. nasty stuff. Thanks for the heads up.

 

Here an advise I read recently from an unrelated topic but relevant here. Edited to suit my use
"To those people complaining loudly and verbosely about something they don't like and trying to make it into a vague moral failing:
What he needs to do is get over himself and realize that progress doesn't look like what you want it to look like; that you should learn to accept the world rather than just like a child expect the world to conform to your purist expectations."
That doesn't mean you should stop fighting for your cause. Just be more realistic and reasonable.

About fan-translations status. I'm not denying that some just doing it for profit. But don't lump everyone together and hate them for it. So what if the translator profited millions but still proclaimed being fan-translations. It could be truly fan first and profit is just bonus. Or profit first and fan second. Still fan related, just less pure. Imo, they are mostly mixed. When come the boring part, it's money that keep the motivation high.

"Love the work but hate the monetize/business part". I can understand that stance. Money can easily bring out the bad part of human nature after all. But please do hate the bad part, not the general money/business part. Unfortunately, reason often become the victim when strong feeling such as love or hate involve. When clouded by hatred, even good work can be seen as the opposite. And if there a flaw to pick, it will further strengthen the hatred.

My opinion on monetize part: It is great that fan-translator get stable income to the point that they can do full-time. We get experienced translator doing dedicated work instead of new translator come and go. More pay, more releases is win-win for everyone. I think a bit of greed is fine too (make more money that it actually should be, there is no actual standard anyway). It's part of human nature and we want to squeeze as much as we can. Who doesn't want more profit when there is opportunity to do so? Ok you saint can drop your hand. And you money grubber, get down
Problem arise when human get too greedy. We get someone holding hostage; no pay no release. Poaching for profit, slander, lying and more. We all have see it. And here, we get to see backstabbing as well (still not really clear on what actually happen though). But still, don't misplace the hatred, hate the bad action. Keep in mind that mistake do happen.

Lastly, I agree that the original author deserve more recognition and reward for their hard work. Sadly, most profit often goes to business entity and young master. Yes, they play their part too, and there are successful rich author too. It's a good thing that with success, the original author have more power to negotiate better contract.

 

Well to argue further on this fan translation stuff we got to have a basically definition of the term or we can't get anywhere. I'm not telling you that making money out of this is a bad thing (i don't care what others do with their life). But the sermon "i'm doing this for the community" has to drop at some point. It's like in this world full of good samaritans i'm the bad guy at the end of the day. This i cannot accept

 

Agreed. I hate it too when someone make "for the community" or similar claim. Hate it even more when it is used to justify questionable action.
Edit: To be clear, I'm not against anyone doing something for the good of the community. It just the shameless claim.

 

The law doesn't really come into play here. "Fan translation" isn't a legal term. Both fan translators and non-fan translators are guilty of violating the restrictions on distribution, and both could be considered willful.

Thus It's more about the motives and actions of the TL.

 

yeah for sure stop the money and you will know who the real fan translator are

 

1)I'm looking at it purely from a readers's point of view.

Regardless of it being a per chapter donation, or a monthly patreon style, there is a logical maxium number of chapters a TL can do without sacrificing quality.

From a pure readers perspective, I couldn't care less about the overall money to chapters ratio. That doesn't effect me. Even from a donators perseptive, as long as the number of chatpers nears the max the TL can reasonably do, then it's a benefit.

In fact, it's BETTER for the average donator, because they can get more chapters while giving less, because more people are giving. And thats completely outside the advance chapters.

Saying that people are "overpaying" when they get more while spending less is silly. Just because more people are paying doesn't devalue what you've paid for.


2)not entirely sure how this makes sense as a response to my #2.

What does this have to do with him lashing out at others that have been backstabbed?

Who cares if he's a "fan translator" or not? What does that have to do with anything? From my perspective, he's just trying to use that as some sort of high ground to justify himself. It makes him seem pretentious.

How are the moves by places like WW or Volare "unnecessary"? They are inevitable. Neither invented donation incentives nor patreon, and licensing would have become necessary eventually anyways.

Even without donations, WW was generating huge amounts of revenue through ads years ago. Even GT, a much smaller site was generating revunes of around $200,000 in 2016. The publishers were not going to ignore this forever.

3)

A) Which is ridiculous. He's just throwing out blame and the biggest targets and lumping completely unrelated groups together.

B) which still doesn't excuse calling for a ton of groups to be banned.

4) Then stop defending him. Let him make his own justifications. Seriously, nothing you have said makes him post any less nonsensical, and it makes him look worse.
So far I've gotten the impression of him as a jealous, pretentious hypocrite that's lashing out and anything tangentially related to his problems.

The "only website that cares" incident doesn't help either.

 

Not really.

You'll wipe out fan and non-fan translators alike. Running a website costs money. Translating takes time.

Sans money and most won't have the time or means to do this beyond a chapter or two a week, hosted on wikia's or forums that can provide them with free access.

While a few might be able to continue as before, they likely already have enough money to be able to invest the time, or are young enough that they have enough time to do it regardless.

 

arguing like this is so pointless
intent can't be used... "for the community" slogan is proof of this
you stand on your side i'll stand by mine we both can live happy this way
for me who takes money can't be considered a fan translator, who don't stop translating when asked to stop from the author isn't a fan translator.
It's not like you have a gun pointed at your head that you have to translate something for fan.
And by saying all of this I want to point out that i'm not against translators who take money (i do not care what they do).

 

As long as you're fine with that meaning that there are almost no fan translations then.

I just find that a bit useless as a definition.

Also, why would not stopping your translation mean you aren't a fan translator? You're ostensibly translating it because you like it and want other people to read it. Respect for the author isn't really required.

 

In the end you came here. This is what i'm trying to tell you till the start of our journey.
If you start to take money there's no way to tell the difference anymore. What is the limit?
edit. for the second part i refuse to argue about that if you don't respect the author the word fan has no meaning to you

 

What?
also, my first reply to you already said this. If money is the factor, then 99% of translations are not fan ones.

A fan of the work does not equate a fan of the author. For example, I could be a fan of Chris browns music, but have zero respect for him as a person.

 

You're right but in your first post you insisted on arguing about the intent now you dropped that crap and you are starting the crap of the author that's even more disgusting so i'm done.

 

you deserve a like

 

Sigh.

re-read my posts.

First, I never dropped intent. Deciding to address your argument instead isn't dropping something. To me Intent is still the core of what makes a fan translator. Is it hard to quantify? yes of course it it. But it can be see through quality and care, and how people interact.

Second, I'm trying to point out that many people are fans of things rather than people. You're trying to define a fan translator as one that does it not for money, but because they love what they are translating.

All I'm saying is that those people aren't necessarily going to have the same feelings for the author. If they have an issue with the author, but still love the work, they are still fans, just not of the author.

They aren't doing it for money, but simply to share something they love. That's not necessarily an altruistic thing, fandom isn't some pristine pedestal.

That is a separate issue.

 

Work hard translating 500 chapters.. Then piss them all away because you got back stabbed.. Man.. If you are going to get upset.. Take as much money as you can from the people who screwed you. Don't gift them your work!

 

I'm guessing he didn't actually have a choice, and that someone he worked with sold the rights to QI, talking the cash for them, which he agreed to "indirectly" because the contract was misrepresented.

 

Your guess is wrong. No one sold the rights but we gifted them. Part of our deal was to make sure that Gu Xi (author of the novel) got all the money.

Edit: I'm not sure whether the author got the money or not but its not on my conscience.