Discussion Japan's Extreme Mentality as Portrayed Through their LN/WN

Discussion in 'General Chat' started by Superioreos, Mar 11, 2018.

  1. Superioreos

    Superioreos Well-Known Member

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    Thank You, I will look into those.
     
  2. Robinxen

    Robinxen Well-Known Member

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    I think the heart of the problem is more how saturated the market is.
    A protagonist is the soul of a story, so it's easier to give them a big flashy strength and weakness that's easy to portray and attract attention.
    "Oh this guy is as dense as a rock, but when it comes to those critical moments he never lets people down."
    Or "This guy is a genocidal maniac who couldn't care less what the readers opinion of him is."

    In addition, Light Novels and Web Novels are not particularly good mediums for getting the gritty parts of a characters psychology fleshed out. since the focus is mainly on inter-character dialogue, not very often is the character alone to develop their complete mindset.
     
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  3. Superioreos

    Superioreos Well-Known Member

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    I understand that it is not a representative sample, but as food for thought, I think it is interesting.
     
  4. Zorgh12

    Zorgh12 Well-Known Member

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    Note that most of this MC who hates killing mostly come from shounen genre which is aim toward teens and young adult. If you delved deeper into seinen genre you'd find those stuff like Black Lagoon, Jormungand, Berserk, Hellsing and more.

    EDIT: Immature MC is the reason why I don't watch shounen anymore and as I grew up, I am more interested in the seinen genre. Make sense I suppose considering the demographic.
     
  5. forecast

    forecast [Batoto Veteran] [sakurahana veteran]

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    This is the same for every novel though.
    The common sense is based on what and where the author grew up in, not just in jp novels.
    Though in jp novels there is a flip side. where one side is dense, one is too brutal.

    In chinese and korean novels they are mostly the same. Super cruel, money hungry, arrogant MC's.
     
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  6. Superioreos

    Superioreos Well-Known Member

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    True.
     
  7. Ai chan

    Ai chan Queen of Yuri, Devourer of Traps, Thrusted Witch

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    As someone who is in Tokyo a lot, I agree that they are quite extreme. They are extremely law abiding, follows the rules (mostly), does not do things that will trouble others and do not seek confrontation. The Japanese tend to have mob mentality, which means they try to conform with the bigger group, becoming part of that bigger group instead of practicing their individuality. That's why those who want to practice individuality tend to get ostracized in one way or another.

    On the other end of the spectrum, their extreme behaviour can be seen in their buffet culture. They like cakes. They like sweets. So they did the extreme that can't be found anywhere else. They have cake buffets, a lot of them, beautifully designed. It's like meat buffets, but for cakes. Ai-chan almost died (in happiness) stuffing my face with all kinds of cakes.

    I don't agree that if you remove their pacifist attitudes, they will revert to their old ways. The Japanese were not brutal in the first place. The rape of nanking as well as the massacre at Singapore was calculated to break the spirit of the locals. The Japanese soldiers didn't actually want to do it. However, they had to do it because it was an order by their superiors. Failure to follow orders will be met with a bullet in the head. There was no court martial for non-com soldiers in the Imperial Japanese Army. They dealt with insubordination on the spot.

    How do I know? My grandpa was a Japanese soldier who deserted his post after being ordered to kill Chinese civilians (with kuomintern ties) in Singapore for the second time. He surrendered his uniform and weapons and ran into the jungles without carrying anything, not even food because he considered even soldier's food belonged to the emperor. Now, I have to go to Musashi imperial graveyard regularly to read his letter of apology to the late emperor for abandoning his post. He incorrectly thought he betrayed the emperor when he left, when the emperor didn't even want the war in the first place.

    tl; dr
    So my point is, even during the rape of nanking, Japanese soldiers were just normal people. While there were certainly some psychopaths, the reason why it happened was because the higher ups thought their enemies needed a lesson or they needed to be subdued quickly. Isoroku Yamamoto himself said he didn't see any future where the imperial japan could stay on top unless they could finish everything quickly.
     
    Last edited: Mar 11, 2018
  8. Westeller

    Westeller Smokin' Sexy Style!! Staff Member

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    There are pleeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeenty of JP novels that draw a middle ground between total pacifist and "rape of nanking levels of brutality." ... Death March, Skeleton Knight, Sevens, etc etc etc. Some other people in this thread have posted lists of varying lengths. Yes, there are a lot of JP novels with extremely and irrationally pacifistic protagonists, and there are also plenty of JP novels on the complete opposite end of that spectrum. But there are also a lot right in the middle.


    Many of the novels on the pacifistic side of the spectrum are just conforming to genre/publisher requirements, too, y'know...
     
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  9. Harry

    Harry Now you see me

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    In my mind, jp mentality mc is like this
    Male beta mc is a wizard, even holding hand with girl is so lewd, it got censored
    And before mc have a chance give mysterious rare candy to little girl, mc already transmigrated through summoning magic into police car
    Heroine for mc always tsundere who love abuse her authority, while mc despite barking many protest always obediently become yes man (the dog who bark not bite)
    Strangely enough, mc who got abused, get "pervert" label (albeit accidentally happened), always wrong even when mc 200% right if retard tsundere say so... nobody say mc is a M (perfect example is Hidan no Aria, i don't know why people love seeing mc be humiliated, do illogical thing told by red haired tsundere heroine and he never complain)
     
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  10. Cupcake Ninja

    Cupcake Ninja [Kind Sage][Lord Benevolence][ The Great Paragon]

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    bruh all that aint restricted to japs tho. We're all fucked up in that way, its just that kinda literature aint getting passed publishers very often. Jap seems more free in regards to the kinda stories they can get out there, either by legit publishers or through site like RRL or Wattpad or other similar websites(dont know the jap equivolent of these but you get the meanin')

    I feel people of every nation would have these kinda mentalities to some degree or another, they just dont really have many options in letting it out.

    And really i feel the kinda society they live in affects it too. In japan crazy shit is more accepted or maybe even expected in some circles. You can bet yer cute lil chrysanthemum that if a work like, say, seikon no qwaser(dont think its a novel but im not limiting it to just LNs or WNs but stories of this nature or like as a whole) were to be created in another country it wouldnt get nearly as far just due to it being pretty....well you know. Unconventional, as some would say. Wouldnt be as readily accepted in western cultures. Remember that despite its growing popularity, ours is still a pretty niche culture.

    Hm. Feel the last paragraph went a bit outta topic.
     
  11. Superioreos

    Superioreos Well-Known Member

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    That is a fascinating story. (If that came across as sarcastic, I assure you it wasn't.) I also don't think that the Japanese would do that, as I said I joked with my friends.
     
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  12. Kuroguma

    Kuroguma [Cyber Lich] [Aspie] [SOX][Forgotten Perv]

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    Hardly unique to the Japanese, can see the same spectrum in the dc and marvel comic universe, from heroes who don't kill to those who do.
    We have it in western games too. Like deus ex, where one can do a non lethal play trough or just kill everyone. or we could be like the chinese mc kratos and just kill and fuck everything.

    ps. I like god of war, he really is like a chinese mc tho.
     
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  13. asriu

    asriu fu~ fu~ fu~

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    interesting you put rape of nanking
    tbh such thing can happen because of
    ~ success on brainwashing soldier
    ~ ridiculous hierarchy system
    I really think it as interesting way for any dictator wanna be must learn method~

    as for spectrum?
    nah
    just usual thing~
    japan just blessed can convey idea on story relatively more free than other country~
     
  14. Zorgh12

    Zorgh12 Well-Known Member

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    "Meet god, slay god. Meet devil, slay devil." Kratos took it quite literally....
     
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  15. Superioreos

    Superioreos Well-Known Member

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    Super Heroes can be somewhat justified in their lack of killing since in many cases they are supposed to arrest the criminal. What I don't like is when an MC is born into a culture in which killing in war is normal and yet for no reason refuses to kill in war even if it means risking the lives of his friends.
     
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  16. Kuroguma

    Kuroguma [Cyber Lich] [Aspie] [SOX][Forgotten Perv]

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    Some what true, but when f.eks. batman takes it so far he doesn't want to kill joker? On one end, and on the other end we got people like the punisher who kills them all.
    And for not killing in war situations we do have that in the west too, like hercules, the tv series and gabriel from xena. We also have series like the A-team where they are ex military yet never kills in the tv series, even tho they like to use aks and dynamite. :D
     
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  17. FatalStrings

    FatalStrings Admiral: Third Celestial Armada

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    every single time I visit threads like this the nanking massacre always pop up... wierd. what about the tianamen square massacre? I think that is more horrific.

    also If this is a leftist "Safe Space" you would have been branded a racist and IP banned for life. just a warning from a veteran internet lurker
     
  18. MaidChan

    MaidChan 『Battlemaid』 『TRAP』 『Homeless Maid』

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    Pssssst~ dont mention stuffs that can hurt the heart of “Chinese People”...

    Also this place is now part of ancient Chinese territory so watch your mouth, the CCP’s watching you.
     
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  19. Superioreos

    Superioreos Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for the warning. If I were talking about the Chinese I would bring up Tianamen. But why do you think the killing of Tianamen was worse? At most 10,000 people died in Tianamen, but at least 40,000 people died in Nanking, not to mention that Nanking was far more cruel than Tianamen.
    If you were to talk about the total number of people the PRC has made "disappear" (whether officially or not), not to mention the Great Leap Forward and the Cultural Revolution then yes, they are far worse than Nanking. But Tianamen by itself? I have a hard time seeing that.

    They will build artificial internet islands to protect their ancestral territorial internet waters.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 11, 2018
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  20. Sabruness

    Sabruness Cultured Yuri Connoisseur

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    I gotta agree with you. Black Lagoon is basically the discussion point (partly) of this thread in manga/anime form. A japanese inculcated into the restrictive, pacifist, non-confrontational conformist herd culture who is taken out of that and exposed to the worst that humanity has to offer. His attempts to keep to how he's being indoctrinated and his slow, eventual fall into chaos is quite interesting to watch.