I will explain my side. I will understand yours but I won't impose mine to you but expect me to look down on you if you don't understand mine.
Everything is grey, we just lean towards black and white based on our choices. In the end everyone is just trying to "survive and live". Honestly i just want people to understand each other. If their views are in conflict then it will either stay conflicting or resolved in some way.
Hmm, I'm the opposite. I don't care if my opinion is respected or not, only if it has been understood. That and how closely it can be justified. Respect for opinions seems an odd thing to do, unless you are referring to a shared set of cultural values?
I only wish for people to understand not respect it because people tend to look down on the other side. I'm very prone to that so if I can't respect yours then it'd be hypocrisy if I ask you to respect mine.
you are right. why respect it if the other side wont? my mentality is the same. why understand it if they cant understand mine? on the other hand, i know that i have an opinion and that it is created through my personal and unique experiences. then so too do others have sinilarly unique opinions. and i respect that. i dont have to agree with it, i just know that they have one and have a right to have that opinion. why should i dictate what opinions people should have?
another thing to keep in mind is that an opinion can be based on facts and fiction alike. like the infamous game theories, people can disagree by pointing out facts concerning the topic, usually through direct references and key moments. however, with what i am referring to, in a situation where there isnt the ability to play through each option and compare without actually losing any progress, we have no point of reference except the past. But this has lost its relevance as too many variables have popped up. We have societal norms and new laws, we have the advent of technology and the sharing of media and knowledge at our fingertips. trying to judge an opinion using the past is rather...pointless. that is why a scientific theory is just that, a theory. we do not know whether there is a point where gravity does not act correctly, or time bends and light can move faster than normal. things are always subject to change throughout our life, whether we like it or not. and that is why i would rather look at the splendid world we live in during the brief existence that is my life. why bother with the complex drama and negative emotions when we have capybaras?
Every one of us has an idea on how others should spend an ideal life. The thing about us is, we are possessed to worship our interests. To concentrate on the flaws of others and hide our own flaws in disuse. Then, we seem to be living two lives. We have two recounts of everything that has happened. One is what really happened, and the other is what conforms to the mental image of ourselves. Again, we might be collectively standing at a fork road. But all of us don't have to turn together, to go together. Some of us can go and scout ahead, and maybe show the way to the rest. Rather than convincing others to step ahead when ourselves are hesitating to go anywhere. --- In respect to arguments, I enjoy them as long as the points and rebuttals are intelligent and make sense. That is why I enjoy discussing matters with people who can hold their own. As for convincing people? I may not be arguing to convince them at all, I may be arguing to put them down so I can kill the monkey to warn the chickens. In this case, by shutting him down, I would be convincing the people who are around us and undecided on the matter. When you want to convince someone, you must take great pains to not hurt their ego. When someone gets defensive, whatever you say from there will not move anything in them. You will even have to make some concessions to them and have them do the same to convince them. Convincing people is quite different than arguing. You can differ between convincing and arguing with the analogies of theft and robbery in that order. When you are convincing someone, you have to be subtle and you have to play your cards right and not make any noise, like theft, silent and discreet. While arguing is a frontal battle. Here you march on ahead with your troops and behead the one who opposes you. Depending on the gap between powers, there may be a violent clash. When you defeat a person this way, it makes great cheering and celebration. Your enemy may be at his knees at the moment. But he won't be convinced, rather he would silently wait for a day he can exact his revenge. Where he can comeback. Here sticking to his defeated thoughts would become a matter of ego.
There is nothing wrong with tolerating dissenting opinions, actually some would say diversity of thought is the only diversity that really matters. Afterall the universe may very well be infinite but my senses are not, who am I to be the sole arbiter of objective truth? Our right to appreciate capybaras is maintained by a government who protects our freedom and rights to do so. So sometimes, the drama and tension of rigorous discussion is worth it because we can watch capybaras. And if you think it isn't...well, at least we have cute creatures to watch.
here is a matter i dont agree with, but i understand and respect. life is a battle that we all fight. but the need to actually combat others has lessened over the years and the common way in most societies is to be inclusive and accepting "all" ideas. this can lead to common phrases such as, 'one bad apple spoils the bunch' or what have you. so i can understand trying to remove others you dont agree with. I may not like it, but hey. as long as you dont break the law or unjustly act towards me, i wont really care. but we have to remember that eventually, things will change. the opinion you have may become the defeated some day. how would you react? would you conform or fight back? fighting back results in consequences unless you can win. but you have already been defeated. if you fight back, people will call you doubling down, obstinate, and backwards. the world seems to be pushed by society, and we can always try to do something different, try to go against the stream, but you will always be looked down upon by others. 'lazy' 'barbaric' 'selfish' 'coward' 'idiot' 'stuck up' when we make a change...well, every action must have an equal and opposite reaction. it is like the universe (or god if you believe) is actively making it difficult to change, as @lnv mentioned. by the way, loving the back and forth on this thread. i feel somewhat enlightened.
It is either that you misunderstood what I wrote, or I misunderstood this thread. For we really jumped from the simple matters of arguing and convincing to acceptance, difference of interests, value judgement and etc etc. Look, in my terms, I would rather not conform nor deny with the general trend of what's happening. Doing either one of them would be an insult to my consciousness. If society and it's norms had to make decisions for us, we would have a similar structure to ants where everything is governed by the will of the queen ant. If it's something I find feasible with my standards and morals, I shall do it. And if it's aligned with the trend of the world, that's good. And if it ain't, then that's all the better. You may think the society is going more towards the acceptance phase, well you couldn't be more wrong here. There are always layers to the truth and it's not that simple. For example if I ask you a question whether you are religious or not, you could either answer by saying yes or no. But then there is a devout believer, a practicing believer and a non practicing one. What I mean to say, there are endless branches to the truth and they may all carry the truth. Similarly, on the surface people may appear to be more inclined towards peace and tolerance but within themselves, they are at the peak of intolerance. The divorce rates are climbing, and every bad thing is reaching out for us. In some western families, you would see several dads or several moms, paternity courts are a thriving thing there now, and you can realise whose child is whose several years in the marriage. If they marry at all. The society is dysfunctional. You can clearly recognise in things with a little less restraint, that's actually what's keeping the order. For example Muslim students are harassed in western countries. And there are still gang wars going around, and there's still extremism and the black vs white fight. But you may think they are all better now and people are more tolerant, well that's restraint working over generations. If you happen to know a little about prisons where more raw characteristics of people are exposed, they are quickly banded into their groups in accordance with their race and religion and group or colour. It's because here they aren't restricted to accept otherwise. Well, the dynimcs are too tricky to understand and even more tricky to explain.
my bad. quotation marks are deemed as sarcastic, so i was referring to their actions as hypocritical without going too deep. society is essentially one mindless mob that is run by the loudest voices of discontent. We are fed media that is negative and counterproductive as an agenda in order for us to conform. that is why in my poll, the metaphorical people talking are arguing and not going anywhere. they have all conformed to the idea of going as a group, that anybody striving by themselves are regarded as weird or immoral or troublesome. oh yeah, this entire thread has some major tones. but yeah. i get you. we are all for ourselves while holding the mantle of acceptance. we are wolves in sheepish clothing.
Actually we are forced collectively to embrace acceptance. This is not the right way to go. Here, there will only be order as long as there is restraint. Without restraint, there would be no order. Like a lion and sheep in different cages could preserve them both since they are restrained and there will be order because both of them will be alive. But as soon as the restraint disappears, the lion will tear apart the sheep with even more viciousness, for it never learned to tolerate, it was only forced to do so. Say if chaos occurs due to a fire or an event, hell will break out. For in that event, the restraint on people would disappear, and what would remain would be their indignation for the time of forceful acceptance. We should move away from forceful acceptance and preach tolerance from within ourselves. As an example, we shouldn't mindlessly accept anything and tolerate everything. I for one don't accept the rapid acceptance to nudity, while people are suppressed under the restrains of feminism and what not. Tolerance should be there but a mindful one. You should tolerate people who hold from a different ethnic background, who hold different facial colour, who hails from a different piece of the world, who speaks a different language and who believes in a different religion. As long as your neighbour's loud music isn't a frequent thing, you should be tolerant of them. A mindless and a forceful tolerance only leads to suppressed resentment and indignation, and when they explode they do a lot of damage.
For some reason, your words strike me towards the path of revolution. [not really] ~I was just reminded about a history class I had about the American Revolutionary war. There was a pamphlet written by Thomas Paine called "Common Sense" Between you and @Evil_Ginger, your points and counter-points really held my attention. So bravo!
To be honest everyone is just stuck, those that are past the emotional phase and can move on using logic and common sense are not doing anything becuz our numbers are smaller compared to the rest that are stuck in the emotional phase where although they have fully grown they still haven’t learnt to keep emotions to the side and think through logic and common sense first. And then there are those that have grown and can use logic but have no common sense what so ever and end up at the wrong/ different conclusion and those that simply don’t care... I’m quite disappointed in human evolution at those point because we have evolved to use our brain but even after the countless evolution we won’t be able to get to our final form and we just go backwards