Discussion Why does Japanese stories and games favor slavery so much?

Discussion in 'Novel General' started by Lazytophat, Sep 13, 2018.

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  1. Katsurandom

    Katsurandom [The One That Does Nothing][Villager C]

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    Death March has LN (that counts as book?) where pochi, tama, arisa & lulu are happy and are "Elite" as you speak........though
     
  2. Kurotsubaki

    Kurotsubaki Reincarnation of the Seven Deadly Sins

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    Because it still exist now
    Although the form might differ
     
  3. tornberry

    tornberry Well-Known Member

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    Wtf? Some people already said it in this thread, its because the setting of those titles with slavery are fantasy in medieval, primitive era. I am legit confused about the point of this thread. I thought its a common sense.

    Or rather, can OP name any japanese manga/anime/novel/games title in modern setting (that has no relation with medieval era) with slavery system?
     
  4. Salokin

    Salokin Well-Known Member

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    Almost all first world nations have it as illegal, and people are generally hyper sensitive. But illegally? Its called human trafficking and is estimated to be as lucrative as the drug trade. Even in first world countries. Brothels are an obvious example but organ rings and farm hands as well as cheap workers who might not speak the native tongue and can't escape or alert anyone...

    As far as why it features in medieval settings for literature? Human rights may not have been a concept back then, but forcing someone to work for you was. It was a staple of every culture back in the day, although it is frowned upon now.
     
  5. Chiiiiiiiii

    Chiiiiiiiii >Daoist Thirteen Bears< >Hero Astral Saber<

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    Because those authors are loosers and write for fellow wizards, and the only way they know to keep a girl next to them is to make them slaves, it's wish fulfillment to be easily popular with girls.There it is!(y)
     
  6. chencking

    chencking [Daolord Grammar Nazi]

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    No, it does not count. Death March is a LN adapted from a WN, so it falls under online novels. Anyway, I meant to distinctuate the subjects of the conversation, LNs and WNs, from other books. On second thought, my wording fails to consider the subset of LNs that were not adapted from WNs yet depict slavery in such a way. I am not convinced there are any such LNs, but I meant to exclude those from what I consider real books as well.
     
  7. Delirious

    Delirious [Code of conduct]

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    Ya, and everything you just said is either apart of the underworld everyone is disgusted with, or as a shitty country. No first world country has an open legal form of slavery. ya, there are horrible companies but they do not "own" the individual. No matter how twisted things get.
     
  8. 4myzelf

    4myzelf Well-Known Member

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    I just reject the notion that such a book can't exist given the fact that its not that hard to write, its a problem of it being popular given the fact that the whole premise is freeing slaves, but now that you mention it, genjitsushugisha no oukokukaizouki has the MC working on steps to abolish slavery (its just not the main focus) and has a few chapters about slaves not only being freed but given a high status, basically as kng the MC made a proclamation that nobles' territories will increase or decrease based on their management of said territory thus incompetent nobles went looking for talent and 1 slave trader happened to treat his (for lack of a better term) merchendise well by giving them basic education so the nobles cleared his stock and other traders wanted in on it and the slaves as slaves cant legally manage said territory so they just raise their status from slave to free citizens with the social status high enough to manage it. Summoned slaughterer, mc of all the slaves he bought, 2 were freed the rest were put in charge of his fief's government (not sure if they are still slaves). Dont know if those meet your criteria
     
  9. NGCleric

    NGCleric Well-Known Member

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    I wasn't under the impression they were trying to paint in a better light, just that it was something that existed in the time period the setting is based off of and the mc (sometimes) "found" himself with slaves (I know some go out of their way to buy slaves for harem or otherwise purposes). How they are treated often varies, some aim to free the girls (Death March, + several others I don't feel like looking up right now), while others embrace the practice (Slave Harem because it's in the title). How the slaves act often is also determined by the tone of the story. Death March has the girls pretty cheery from the start, despite being in a very hostile environment. It makes sense that after some time with the MC they would (since he cares for them like a proper parent), but they latched on pretty fast. Healer in Another World Labyrinth City also has a slave that latches on pretty fast, though this was due to him curing the girl of her blindness and facial scars (for what it's worth, he did not buy her for harem purposes). For Isekai Maou, it felt more like the MC and the girls have recognized it as a blunder and treat it more of as an inconvenience, looking for a way to break it (apparently complicated magic is involved). They never act like slaves and he doesn't treat them like slaves. Many of the girls that are happy to be "owned" by the MC are probably that way because in those stories, the MC generally does not treat them poorly.

    TLDR: I don't think they were trying to make slavery look like an okay thing to have (many stories talk about the horrible stuff that lead to characters being enslaved). It is something that existed (in history and setting) and can be an easy way to set up things. The girls are often happy with the MC because they imagined a terrible future and the MC changed all that.
     
  10. chencking

    chencking [Daolord Grammar Nazi]

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    You misunderstand. An emancipated slave is no longer a slave. Frederick Douglass would be a perfect counter-example if that was what I had been talking about, but I was referring to how some WNs make characters elite while slaves. And that's an absurd idolization of slavery. Also, I never said such a book can't exist. I said to the best of my knowledge, such a book doesn't exist. The obvious barrier is the inherent contradiction in making slavery a happy thing. I doubt any real publisher (ie. not a LN) would ever invest in such a book, because it would come off as a white supremacist piece of crap.
     
  11. Mystic.reader

    Mystic.reader Well-Known Member

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    ofcourse it is because these isekai novel writers has no understanding in to the concept of romance but the story require them... they know that if they try to write a love story between the characters with their writing skill and the timid and worthless personality their mc have been portrayed, it would just embarrass both the author and the reader... so they opt to the more easier plot line that is an obedient slave that falls for the masters kindness..
     
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  12. Ai chan

    Ai chan Queen of Yuri, Devourer of Traps, Thrusted Witch

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    Copy-pasted from https://forum.novelupdates.com/posts/959265/ because this question has been asked for so many times Ai-chan can't be bothered making a new post.

    Just a little info.

    The Japanese people themselves didn't traditionally practice slavery. Their idea of slavery (that they adapted into their novels and mangas) came from what they understood (or misunderstood) about European medieval period. By the late 1500s, slavery was made illegal by Toyotomi Hideyoshi, the shogun of that time who took over after Nobunaga's death. Even before that, the Japanese people in general including the upper class daimyo and samurai hated the very idea of slavery and only barely tolerated it, considering it dishonourable conduct.

    On the other hand, from records recovered from that era, the only people who loved taking Japanese girls away were the Portuguese, who brought them to Portugal to be used as sex slaves. It was said that these Japanese girls were actually the first Japanese people to set foot in Europe. Now, we also know from history lessons that at this time slavery is rampant in Europe. Even a couple hundred years later, it's still commonly used in their American colonies.

    So you see, it's not that slavery is normal to the Japanese. The Japanese thought slavery is normal to the Europeans. The only people who practiced slavery in Japan during Japanese warring states era weren't even Japanese.

    In a way you can say that they can take pride in being more morally upright because they did away with slavery much earlier than the Europeans and Africans but since they came to 'European setting', they have to abide by local customs. This is another Japanese quirk, they always try to follow local customs whenever possible.
     
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  13. Soren59

    Soren59 MTL Shill

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    Convenient plot tool for getting beautiful girls to be loyal to a generic protagonist with little to no charm.
     
  14. Wujigege

    Wujigege *Christian*SIMP*Comedian

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    There are too types of slavery.
    1. Vanilla one that is indentured servitude
    2. The cruel type that involves racism or war captives.

    A homogenous country like Japan does not understand racism. It's that simple.
    Modern Japan never experienced colonial rule either, they were the ones invading other places and ruling them eg Taiwan and Korea.
    It's a lack of empathy
     
  15. Yukkuri Oniisan

    Yukkuri Oniisan 『Procrastinator Archwizard Translator and Writer』

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    Considering that many webnovelist are just amateurs, I think they write based on what they understand. To worldbuild means to use your library of knowledge to create a setting of fictional culture, language, religion, government, and social mores. Not many writers want to spend too much time building their world from scratch, so they will base their story world on a stereotypical standard world setting, in the case, since they were writing a story mostly influenced by RPGs, they will use a generic Western European world setting as popularized by games such as Dragon Quest and Final Fantasy. Hence the writer will write based on what they think Western European looks like in the medieval period (which unless they like to read history books, will be based on what the Japanese media portray Western Europe at that time).

    So it was the same way most westerners write Ancient Egyptian story with pyramids, pharaohs, sphinxes, cacti, bare-chested men, mummies... Since it how modern media depicted Ancient Egyptian.
    Or how European imagine American as a land of rednecks, guns everywhere, gung-ho cop, and mobster gangs ruling the street. Since it how Grand Theft Auto portray America.

    Basically, slavery is a part of "theme-park European setting pack" that Japanese familiar with, the same as "theme-park Japanese setting pack" with ninjas, samurai, daimyos, bowings, polite insults, etc, that westerners familiar with. Since that "theme-park European setting pack" had been used to death by their senpais, the newbie writers adapt that setting into their own story, rather than worldbuilding from the start. Hence the prevalence of slavery, since for Japanese, that was 'normal' in Western European setting, just like Dragons, Knights, Kings, Princesses, and Peasants dying in throve.

    All in all, I think my Western European Historical knowledge mostly came from playing Crusader Kings 2. So if I write a story based in Western Europe, expect Incest, Baby Killing, Backstabbing, Satan Worship, and Imprisoning the Wife so she will die because my Ruler wants to marry the hot 18 years old girl who will inherit some random German Duchy. Since that how I imagine Western Europe will be.
     
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  16. lnv

    lnv ✪ Well-Known Hypocrite

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    Have you seen the male MC in most novels? Who would want to be around them if not a slave?
     
  17. Nimroth

    Nimroth Someone

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    Eh, the person you are quoting didn't even mention legality so why are you bringing up anti-slavery laws as a counter to a point that wasn't made in the first place?
     
  18. Wujigege

    Wujigege *Christian*SIMP*Comedian

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    If only I can read about Japanese protagonists like Ippei-san

     
  19. Belgarion_V

    Belgarion_V 『The Supreme Chuuni』『Explosion Loli』

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    did I say open slavery? I don't see that anywhere...Not being done in the open doesn't make it any better or worse. It just lets people ignore easier...
     
  20. Delirious

    Delirious [Code of conduct]

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    Well, I might have jumped the gun a bit but, my whole point was that it isn't normal. Even if it wasn't your intent, you made it sound like it was a normal thing today like it was in the "past" when it isn't.

    @Nimroth
    My answer is above.
     
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