Question Fairy?

Discussion in 'Novel General' started by GabeZhul, Jan 19, 2019.

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  1. GabeZhul

    GabeZhul Well-Known Member

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    Okay, this has been bugging me for a while: Whenever a female character of a CN novel is beautiful, they are almost always called a "fairy", either indirectly, or even as part of their address, like "Fairy Yi". Why?

    It's a western (specifically celtic) term that can be either very broad (including things like goblins, kobolds, leprechauns and the like) or very narrow (tiny winged sprites), but either way, it's not native to chinese folklore. Is this a translation convention?

    I mean, it's not really bothering me per se, as I have gotten used to it the same way as I understand "giving face" and "face slapping" beyond their literal meaning, but I always wondered what this was supposed to be in the original chinese context. Some kind of nymph, or goddess, or spirit, or what?
     
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  2. Lonelycity

    Lonelycity Well-Known Member

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    It is cultural.... I don’t know what the word they use in the novels is... but I think they refer to the celestial nymphs the Apsaras.

    I don’t know if they are to be called a species or job class or just a social tier but here goes the link
    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apsara

    It’s a Hindu/Buddhist thing.
     
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  3. ReadOrDie

    ReadOrDie already dead

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    Quick google pic... What horror is that? That ain't no jade beauties. *Shivers.
     
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  4. GabeZhul

    GabeZhul Well-Known Member

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    Yup, that sounds about right. It's just weird, since apparently it's common to translate the term as "muses" or even just "nymps" as well. Those are actually famous for their beauty, while when it comes to fairies, the first things that come to mind are usually "tiny", "winged" and "trickster", with "beautiful" being way down the list, yet it's the latter that became a convention.
     
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  5. Lonelycity

    Lonelycity Well-Known Member

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    Hmmm you must have seen so many depictions of the kingdom of heaven of Chinese mythos.... all those beautiful women are technically apsaras.
    That’s tranaslations for you.... some things get twisted in the process....
     
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  6. Siceraria

    Siceraria Well-Known Member

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    It is like calling the "humans" in Chinese novels human even though:
    1. Humans don't have gallons of blood to cough up every time a stronger person farts in their general direction.
    2. Humans normally have eyes that can see Mt. Tai.
    3. Humans don't have skin like jade.
    4. Humans don't shoot energy beams out of their hands.
    5. Humans can't block weapons with their bare hands.
    6. Humans can't say paragraphs of how awesome they and their ancestors are while throwing a punch.
    7. Humans don't fly on magical swords and absorbing qi that kills off any rationality and self-preservation.
     
  7. AlreadyGoneAway

    AlreadyGoneAway New Member

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    More often than not the word "fairy" that you see in the translation is the translator's choice of translation for "Xian" (Immortal) that is more appropriate and accurate for the context.
     
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  8. 222222

    222222 12121212121212121212121212121212121212121212121212

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    Fairy = very white skin
     
  9. The Hamster Overlord

    The Hamster Overlord Mad scientist/Revered wizard/Alleged antichrist

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    Fairy as in fair and fairy-tale, so it kinda goes on its associated words?
     
  10. GabeZhul

    GabeZhul Well-Known Member

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    ... But fairies don't have very white skin. Sure, they are fair-skinned, since the classic fairy/sprite originates from north-western Europe, where everyone was fair-skinned, but I don't think fairies are ever described as having an especially light skin tone. The creatures that originate from said folklore with the unearthly beauty combined with very pale skin are not fairies, but vampires.

    That said, with AlreadyGoneAway's comment, I wonder if it's more of an accidental convention. Like, some MTL program, or an old translation group, used "fairy" instead of "immortal" or "apsara", and the term got stuck by inertia.
     
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  11. ReadOrDie

    ReadOrDie already dead

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    I see... The mythology does derive from some aspect of Buddhism. They're some different interpretations and depictions from Hinduism but still from the same root I guess.
     
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  12. Lonelycity

    Lonelycity Well-Known Member

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    Technically the eastern term fairy is different from the word immortal vis-à-vis when it comes to mythos... I mean there are women in the stories who are immortals but are not apsaras... (aka the closest word that comes to fairies) so yeah ?
     
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  13. GabeZhul

    GabeZhul Well-Known Member

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    Maybe that's why someone decided to call it "fairy" then? To avoid confusion with the actual immortals in the story? It sounds like something I can certainly imagine an overworked translator would do just to keep things rolling.
     
  14. canaria23

    canaria23 『  』

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    Fairy maidens, celestial maidens, immortal maidens. Fairy is a title for female cultivators.other translations are hard to pronounce or too long of a name, in short translators being lazy. Too many used it and the name stuck.
     
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  15. AerynW

    AerynW Well-Known Member

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    仙女 xiānnǚ and 仙子 xiānzǐ are terms used to describe a woman's extraordinary beauty. Commonly translated as Fairy.
    Not the same as the western concept of fairies. Oddly enough, my old ass electronic dictionary also translates them as Fairy and not literally as Immortal/Celestial Maidens/Lady/etc....
     
  16. otaku31

    otaku31 Well-Known Member

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    I think @AlreadyGoneAway is right. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xian_(Taoism) should clear up ur doubts.
     
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  17. Meloman

    Meloman My dog is lazier than me

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    Fair - fairy- my fair lady- beauty- belle- beautiful lady/girl?
     
  18. Irie

    Irie Internet Bystander

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    Err I guess you can consider it a subclass under immortal? It's specifically referring to the ones who reside in heaven(uh the chinese one with the jade emperor) with the celestial robe and all that. Since there's other immortal women like animal and plant spirits.
    So when they call someone with the Fairy title it just means they're as beautiful as the ones in heaven
     
  19. tides

    tides Well-Known Member

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    no. you guys are wrong.

    the term used is 仙女.
    it just means a female immortal. there is no 仙子 either in the past (until recent wn fiction) as far as i know because 仙人 is usually used to describe male immortals.

    仙人 is actually unisex and just means an immortal in toaism, but fiction added a female (女) to make the gender known.

    later on, chinese men started to refer to pretty women as 仙女 because all of the immortals who are female are often described as being extremely beautiful. so there are many people referring to their idol as their 仙人/goddess today.

    in some chinese tv shows today, female immortals are also referred to as 仙女, but it does not mean fairy, it just means a female immortal.


    仙女.never meant fairy, because there is no such thing as a fairy in chinese history/folklore/stories/fiction/whatever

    仙女. becoming fairy is due to translators who could not find a better word to refer to them, and other translators using it, just like how every translator is calling the yuanying stage as Nascent Soul now without knowing what it actually means


    many people think that these cultivation stages are all part of cn culture/history/whatever, but its actually all made up, and very recently.

    there is no "realms/stages" on the road to immortality if you know anything about taoism, and xianxia is actually a pretty recent genre.
     
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