Spoiler Latest Chapter Discussion Thread for Death Mage Raws

Through what channels?
Its not like has television or radio. I doubt there is even such concept as news paper. Divine Messages are misunderstood more often than not. Even Alda had to cause a solar eclipse to appeal to the masses. As such, even if Van wished to spread the truth and influence the hearts of the people, he does not have a convenient channel to use.

 

Concerts and word of mouth, of course.

 

Its not going to cut it. Word of mouth is as reliable as broken jungle telephone. Even if trustworthy agents from Talosheim are send to every city, on what authority would people believe those agents?
So far, only Kanako can run concerts, even if she tours the entire continent it is going to take time for her to reach every single location. I doubt that Amid empire will let Kanako to hold a concert that spreads propaganda that goes directly against their own doctrin (and God).

At the end of the day, the most efficient way to convei information to the majirty of population would be through the church and that is exactly why Botin's and Paria's priests were imprissoned.

 

@Eddy andres I don´t expect things would go smouthly or people would believe quickly even if Schneider goes to several places [while causing a comotion since he is wanted on Amid Empire] doing quick public annoucements [and running away after delivering those messages], but I believe it would not be meaningless: pilling up many actions would create precedents, Schneider & cia [Storm of Tyranny members], even if they´re wanted, they still hold GREAT INFLUENCE, any serious anouncement made by them cannot be ignored by both public and elite.

Remember that long ago Zuruwarn and Ricklent send divine messages to those they bestowed their DP about helping vida´s races and now we have Botin and Peria oracles as well. There are already precedents about Ogamis revealing acceptance towards vida, even if only a small fraction of influential people and the masses, those with either a good intuition or sharp mind to put 2+2 together, have awareness of it, any additional effort is not useless.

If it was me i would compile a small yet important amount of information on paper and ask to Gufadgarn help Storm of tyranny to do a quick travel across the Empire [and why not Orbaum too?] distributing it to several organizations and people about some important events that would not sound much absurd at all while been difficult for alda extremists/enthusiasts to refute.
In order to gain as little more credibility as possible, writing some important information known by the upper schelons of nobility or other important organizations/groups, information that cannot be dennied and should not normally known by Scheneider been made public would resulte in people have more awareness toward not only what is being revealed, but future claims and events would have a instead increase in credibility.

For the first "book" to be delivered to the world by the Stormy of Tyranny, i would write a bit about the Mirg Shield nation war against talosheim 200 years ago been incited by the 3 purebleed vampires of Hyhiryushikaka through connections and deals with nobles of Amid Empire by having them easely incite the extremists into a reckless invasion with the aim to destroy Talosheim, acquisation of heroes´bodies to make zombies including Michail (making sure to enphasize this been the reason why Mickhail never became a heroic spirit), and the Empire weakening. Not forgeting to mention that the recent Mirgh expedition failure was planned once again by the vampires and new corrupte nobles.
To make things more interesting, bringing to light that the amid empire intelligence agency & force did a operation to wipe out corrupt nobles and vampires in secret, listing the names of such nobles that Amid´s Governament want to keep secret at all costs shouldn´t be much difficult for Van to find out and help to give some credibility.

Talosheim expedition aside, still in the first set of news it would be mentioned that Zuruwarn & Ricklent choose to side with vida - mention about their oracles contents given to their priests and those with their DP .
Confirmation that heroes of Vida unsealed Botin, Peria has awakened and choose to side with Vida, Zantark has already recovered his sanity [despite it not be a secret to us, remember that people don´t know Zantark fused with 2 evil gods long ago as well about him being together with Vida and fought against Alda and Pharmaun. The current human world - ban gaia south region not included here - only know about his frenzy due to a maddening poison/curse from evil gods/guduranis and his recovery was always complete oblivious to the world], this way, the fact that all Ogamis do not agree with Alda and never have sided with him after their slumber could have it´s first steps to become a widespread.

Don´t matter how much absurd such news may sound, there are important events known to many and important classified information as well as logic dificult to retort being presented. New information and sets of news can be continued to be delivered, new oracles to be send and apearence of new heroes acknowledging vida´s races displaying their peria, botin, zuru&rick divine protections while no one from Alda side gainning the other Ogamis DP appearing - or even losing DP, in case of those who acquired their DPs but keep believing Alda is full right not changing their stance, such priest/heroes could paint mud to ogamis faces and the lost of DP would become a matter of course given time.

If Storm of Tiranny could receive title like "MESSENGERS OF THE 6 GREAT GODS" from Vida & cia, display it to the masses and influential people and revel that they were granted with audiences with the 6 other Ogamis, keep revealing information like being directed told by the 6 Ogamis their opnions and analises about what happened until know, even the view of God of the world of champions [God of Earth], whom they are indebted, that doesn´t has any good view/relationship about Alda and Alda´s polices.

Reveal that If Earth´God was asked for help by Zuruwarn like 100k years ago, he would gladly help Zuruwarn,Rick,Vida, Zantark, Peria and Botin, but DEFINILY NOT ALDA.

I can´t help but think that it can have some good effect in long term

Swiching Topic by the way... has Van acquired any skill with a similar effect of vitality enlargement and mana enlargement for all other status? Cause there is a "+(*1% status base value here*) " in his strenght, agility, stamina and inteligence and it is DEFINILY NOT the amount increased by leveling up Job cause it´s parenthesis is by the side as well.

Spoiler: Van Status when changing job to Kurifoto

・ Name: Vandaloo Ark Hillwillow Solda Zakart

-Race: Dampeel (goddess)

・ Age: 12 years old

・ Two names: [Ghoul Emperor] [Emperor] [Guardian of the Pioneer] [The Son of Vida] [Leader] [Emperor] [Hero] [Large King] [Devil Emperor] [Aggressor] [Black Blood Emperor] [Ryu Emperor] [Stall King] [Genius Tamer] [True Ruler of the Red Light District] [Guardian Saint of Transformation Equipment] [Liberator of the Goddess]　

・ Job: Kurifoto

・ Level: 0

・ Job history: Death attribute magician Golem Alchemist Undead Tamer Speller Poisonous hand swordsman Alchemist Magician Great enemy Zombie maker Golem sculptor Demon officer Demon lord Swordsman Samurai Warrior Granted One-Sleep Yumu-Demon Demon Urgos Whip Tongue God Enemy Death Magician String Sergeant Great Demon King Devil-Mage Master



・ Capability value

・ Life force: 860,946+ (51,657) (69,668UP)

・ Magic power: 15,778,736,081+ (15,778,736,081) (3,513,135,020UP!)

・ Power: 84,418+ (844)

・ Agility: 78,260+ (782)

-Physical strength: 88,868+ (888)　

・ Intelligence: 114,878+ (1,148)

Spoiler: Van Last Job change

・ Name: Vandaloo Ark Hillwillow Solda Zakart

-Race: Dampeel (goddess)

・ Age: 12 years old

・ Two names: [Ghoul Emperor] [Emperor] [Guardian of the Pioneer] [The Son of Vida] [Leader] [Emperor] [Hero] [Large King] [Ogre Emperor] [Trial Strategy] [Aggressor] [Black Blood Emperor] [Ryu Emperor] [Stall King] [Genius Tamer] [True Ruler of the Red Light District] [Guardian Saint of Transformation Equipment] [Liberator of the Goddess] [Giant Emperor] (NEW)

・ Job: Spirit

・ Level: 3

・ Job history: Death attribute magician Golem Alchemist Undead Tamer Speller Poisonous hand swordsman Alchemist Magician Great enemy Zombie maker Golem sculptor Demon officer Demon lord Swordsman Samurai Warrior Granted One-Sleep Yumu-Demon Demon Urgos Whip Tongue God Enemy Death Magician String Sergeant Great Demon King Devil-Mage Master Clip Photo Demon Ruler



・ Capability value

・ Life force: 924,482+ (55,468) (67,347UP)

・ Magic power: 16,030,429,383+ (16,030,429,383) (503,386,604UP!)

・ Power: 85,638+ (856) (1231UP!)

・ Agility: 80,370+ (803) (2131UP!)

-Physical strength: 88,868+ (888) (1778 UP!)

・ Intelligence: 117,060+ (1,170) (2214UP!)


・ Passive skills

Super power: 2Lv (UP!)

Super-speed playback: 8Lv

Underworld magic: 5Lv

Status error invalid

Magic resistance: 10Lv

Dark vision

Sana

Casting discard: 10Lv

Guidance: Sana Sue

Magical power recovery: 9Lv (UP!)

Follow-up Super Strength: 9Lv (UP!)

Extremely poisonous secretion: Claw tongue: 9Lv

Body infinite expansion and contraction: tongue

Increased attack power when out of hand: Large

Body super strengthening (hair nail tongue): 2Lv (UP!)

Magic yarn purification: 2Lv

Magical power increase: 10Lv

Magical power recovery speed increase: 10Lv

Increased attack power when using magic guns: Large

Increased vitality: 6Lv

Ability value enhancement: Reign: 1Lv (Awakening from ability value enhancement!)

Ability value enhancement: Faith: 10Lv (UP!)

Ability Enhancement: Vidal Empire: 5Lv

Self-regeneration: cannibalism: 4Lv

Ability value enhancement: cannibalism: 4Lv

Increased ability when gathering souls: Small

Murder recovery: 7Lv

Self-strengthening: Killing: 7Lv

Enhancing magical power when equipped with a wand: Large

Strengthening all ability values: maximum



・ Active skills

Blood generation: 5Lv (UP!)

Limit transcendence: 10Lv

Golem creation: 9Lv (integrated one dimension teacher and devil narration!)

Virgin world magic: 1Lv

Magical precision control: 5Lv

Theological Spirit: 1Lv

Alchemy: 3Lv

Soul Defeat Technique: 8Lv (Integrate Knight!)

Simultaneous activation: 8Lv

Surgery: 9Lv

Realization: 6Lv

Team: 4Lv

Super fast thinking: 7Lv

Generals: 3Lv

Manipulation: 9Lv

Spear throwing technique: 2Lv

Shouting: 9Lv

Spirit Magic: 6Lv

Demon King Artillery: 8Lv

Reflex group surgery: 8Lv (integration of disgrace!)

Transcend piece limit: 4Lv

Spirit: 3Lv (UP!)

Whip: 4Lv

Spiritual change: thunder

Cane: 4Lv

High-speed flight: 3Lv

Musical instrument performance: 4Lv

Butoh: 2Lv

Muscle surgery: 4Lv

Magical art: 3Lv


・ Unique skills

God Eater: 10Lv

Different souls

Mental erosion: 9Lv

Labyrinth creation: 7Lv

Great Satan

Root

Enemies

Soul Eater: 10Lv

Vida's blessing

Earth blessing

Group thinking: 9Lv

Zantak's blessing

Group operation: 9Lv

Soul body: 5Lv

Demon King's Demon Eye

Origin God (changed from blessing of Origin God!)

Relent's blessing

Zulwan blessing

Complete recording

Soul limit surpassed: 5Lv

Mutagenesis

Demon King's Body

Agami

Botin's blessing

Pelia's blessing

Internal world

It is confunsing me until now, someone please explain me D:!

 

@RichardNova that information although reasonable, has a problem, the source, if they tell the secret of the expedition, they must say how they know it and who killed them, if they talk about corruption they will raise doubts about whether they had to do with the disappearance and death of the nobles some years ago, it is not easy to show a status screen without revealing much controversial information, practically for each positive title of Schneider he has two that would fuck the plan, and about the blessings of the gods, they are not so easy to put and It is common sense that even the blessed can only receive divine messages and things like avatars are basically legends that only some priests know. and as mentioned above, there are no channels available, the priests were arrested for not dismissing the divine messages as soon as they heard them, the guilds of wizards and adventurers could only collaborate from the shadows and vandeliu preferred to take an eye rather than make a deal With any Amid merchant with enough power to reveal such valuable information, well, maybe there is a merchant with whom he would be willing to work in all Amid and that is why he owes his life.

 

If Van wants to spread information, it is better for him to have good reputation first. If he tried influencing popular opinion without reputation he would make many enemies who dismiss him, and that would cause big mess.
Now he is trying to make a good name for himself, and then he would be capable of spreading information through political connections. That would make situation an open secret, what would make job for mass propaganda a lot more effective.

 

Spoiler: The punishment Van chose:

source

 

I just realized that the most valuable resource of the universe of TDM is neither the metal of the gods, nor the fragments of the demon king, the most scarce true resource and of which nothing is possibly conserved, are the tears of vandeliu, perhaps the next and the last time the let's see either or in the death of ketchup. and bringing up the subject, someone could make a description or even a fan fiction of vandeliu's reaction to heinz's death (he can be killed by vandeliu or by someone else).

 

Didn't Van get a seven deadly sins job? I'm not trying to mix That Time I got reincarnated as a slime with DM (I know Rimuru has Gluttony, Van having Pale Rider but idr if he had other Christian dark/evil being jobs).

 

No there is no 7 sins job

 

Sounds like someone is confusing Shield Hero...

 

7 sins are everywhere from web novels to anime. It may even be their favourite theme for inspiring magic. Especially if author has the rpg magic system. There would be nothing surprising if 7 sins were introduced into world of Death Mage.

 

Well death mage is exception i guess. Unless origin have 7 prince of sin and they join with job system. Or vahn eat them which unlikely.

 

Qliphoth is the 10 vices, an older version of the 7 deadly sins.

 

Guidance: Manas-vijnana. Manas-vijnana is a Buddhist concept that can be roughly simplified down to the concept of "attachment to selfhood" (thus the Japanese version reading something along the lines of "knowledge of separateness")
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manas-vijnana
https://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/末那識

【Death-Attribute Mage】, 【Golem Transmuter】, 【Undead Tamer】, 【Soul Breaker】, 【Venom Fist User】, 【Insect User】, 【Tree Caster】, 【Demon Guider】, 【Archenemy】, 【Zombie Maker】, 【Golem Creator】, 【Corpse Demon Commander】, 【Demon King User】, 【Dark Guider】, 【Labyrinth Creator】, 【Creation Guider】, 【Dark Healer】, 【Disease Demon】, 【Magic Cannoneer】, 【Spirit Warrior】, 【Bestowed Fragment User】, 【Dream Guider】, 【Demon King】, 【Demiurge】, 【Whip Tongue Calamity】, 【Dead Spirit Mage】, 【String User】, 【Great Demon King】, 【Vengeful Berserker】, 【Destruction Guider】, 【Dark King Mage】, 【Pale Rider】, 【Chaos Guider】, 【Divine Guider】, 【Divine Enemy】, 【Hollow King Mage】, 【Divine Spirit Mage】, 【Dungeon Master】, 【Qliphoth】, 【Demon Ruler】,【Spirit Therapist】

At best Demiurge has associations with the sin of pride since he's the equivalent of the devil in Gnostic tradition, and Vengeful Berserker could be called wrath based. Van strikes me more as an adherent to the sin of greed given his superficial love of luxury and his central motivation to protect all the love and affection he's found in his current life regardless of the consequences though. Qliphoth could also be considered a Kabbalistic version of the sins (whereas the Sefirot would be the equivalent of the "virtues")... but there's 10 of them and they're pretty... different (things like ruin, desolation, disgust, cruelty are part of the Qliphoth, and that's after making them more understandable... there's versions where some parts of it are just metaphors like burning... and ravens.) And Van's version is clearly more playing up "The (World) Tree of Death" concept than the spiritual failings version of it.

Well, we've learned from the God of Sinful Chains backstory that on the demon king's world the only "sin" was to be weak and foolish. And Origin only has the single gestalt god. So unless we want to argue the 7 remaining high gods of Lambda are actually the 7 deadly sins embodied don't think this is going to work... let's try it!
Alda = Pride ("What I'm doing is right even if I'm committing genocide and all my siblings hate me!")
Vida = Lust (solution to everything is making new races!)
Peria = Sloth? (did nothing and waited for 50,000 years despite being awake)
Ricklent = Envy? (made a system based on EARTH's games, stole the dungeon system from Guduranis)
Zuruwarn = Gluttony? (We see you peering at other worlds desiring their snacks you 4 mouthed lion!)
Zantark = Wrath? (I dunno, god of war)
Botin = Greed? (uh, since she's a god of making stuff? I give up.)

...I don't think it works, but it did at least remind me that Zuruwarn has a somewhat strange attachment to snacks and soft drinks for a non-corporeal being.

 

What about the other 4 that have been destroyed? Or do you not consider them due to them being destroyed?

 

Only had to ask since his actions and jobs have landing in some... Earth-based religious sects and I was thinking more along the lines of the following since He did get Earth's Dark Gods protection/blessing:

[Lust] Van's harem, even if he doesn't touch them, he still builds it in the end (even more ironic since he is a mom-con, hasn't developed in Oedipus complex atm).

[Wrath] .....Heinz and Five Colored Swords, no more.

[Gluttony] Figured Soul Devour and Divine Devour (got from the gluttonous evil god) would've been a bit appropriate here.

[Greed] No need to add more to what @heiro001 stated

[Envy] This could be seen in a more past life ordeal as he was treated like shit by everyone around him until he got to Lambda (no family, no friends, the works)

[Pride] He will be a bit difficult in this spot, but after being able to crush souls and gods at this point.... I understand the Vainglory history (futile pride before the fall), but doesn't exactly qual in this bit in the least vs Puny God and Brainless and co.

[Sloth] Can't exactly pin this one on Van as he's constantly working (then again, he did work to the point he was forced to take a break, hell, would this even count?)

Edit: Figured to include the Eight sin [Despair], this one is basically his whole life and even now in DM (fear of losing everything he loves).

 

@Reman Scimitar, if knowing more about this subject much further back in the thread this debate was already made once, the conclusion was that vandeliu has more of the virtues than of sins, although there were also people who found legal loopholes or exceptions to Very strange rules, you should ask one of the veterans with almost perfect memory to see if they remember where it is, it was very interesting.

 

@Eddy andres, I already weighed that bit earlier on my own head before I posted my question earlier, esp since it's a given that he really isn't a Saint to boot (anyone claiming to be a Saint usually has something to hide), he'll kill who needs to be dealt with and give hand to those who needs it or even flat out ignore them be it a God or man.

 

As a follow up - while Seven Sins would be something expected, I doubt that they will appear now. This story went way too far into Lovecraftian teritory for Seven Sins to have their punch. Seven Sins are a thematically demonic power, and they don't scale well when we look at outer gods. They would work well when Evil Gods were considered powerful enemies, not after Demon King is not enough to defeat main character.