Discussion How do you domesticate animals?

Discussion in 'General Chat' started by lychee, Jan 5, 2020.

  1. lychee

    lychee [- slightly morbid fruit -] ❀[ 恋爱? ]❀

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    Responses with cited sources would be fantastic! If you have no sources and you're making up an answer that's fine too -- but just say so!

    Topic: How to domesticate animals?

    You have showed up in prehistoric Earth, and your immediate impression of the society that you ended up in is that there are no domesticated animals (e.g. dogs, sheep, horses, cattle, chickens).

    Domestication of animals is critical for the agricultural revolution and various other steps in human development. Consequently, figuring out how to domesticate animals is likely a high priority.

    You are aware there are wolves in the wilderness. There are mountain goats and sheep in the mountains (very far away). There are wild geese. You have not been able to find any other animals that have been historically domesticated in Earth's history.
    1. How do you domesticate animals?

    2. How long would it take to domesticate a wolf ==> dog? Years? Decades? Centuries? How many generations?

    3. Which domestic animals are most important?
     
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  2. otaku31

    otaku31 Well-Known Member

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    No wildcats? I know many NUFfians who would love to be enslaved by domesticate cats. :cookie:
     
  3. elengee

    elengee Daoist Ninefaps

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    Like i do my women, rub their nose in the pee. :blobpeek:
     
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  4. TamaSaga

    TamaSaga Well-Known Member

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    All I know is that it takes patience and a careful eye.

    If you're not serious about it, it's generally easier just capturing them and caging them in a sturdy pen and taking maximum precaution when going in to meet them.
     
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  5. lychee

    lychee [- slightly morbid fruit -] ❀[ 恋爱? ]❀

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    My understanding is that these days most of those are just feral domesticated cats.

    A true wild cat... mountain lion? Cougar?

    Not all animals were equally found in different places. It could just be that your area doesn't have that species -- since presumably the ancestors of modern cats came from Egypt.
     
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  6. mmsupreme

    mmsupreme How do I change my custom title?

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    Taming for generations leads to domestication.
     
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  7. otaku31

    otaku31 Well-Known Member

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    Well, I'm not really interested in felines. I would like to domesticate wolves using the carrot-and-stick approach. But I'm worried that my lack of experience/knowledge might lead me to become the carrot. :blobfearful:
     
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  8. Goblin Sleuth

    Goblin Sleuth Well-Known Member

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  9. mir

    mir Well-Known Member

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    1. Make them think it's better to go with you than without you. Bribe them with food. Very slowly. Even if it takes years. Animals can be smart when it comes to obtaining food. Bribe them enough and they'll associate you with food and not danger. As for actually using them for work or something? That might need a few generations (for the animals).

    2. Since wolves are pack animals, it would be easier than some others. You need to make it think of you as one of it's pack. Best way is to get a puppy and raise it. As for making a wolf into a dog, generations.

    3. The ones that pull plows (horses or oxen), the ones you can ride, the ones that give milk, and the ones that give eggs.
    Eggs for steady protein, milk for same (cheese), plow pullers to make things possible, and ridable ones to make travel, communication, etc much more feasible.
    Horses, cows and chickens. Dogs would be useful for protection of yourself and livestock, or for hunting. Cats for protecting grain and reducing disease.

    If you don't have those animals in the area you are in, the horses, cows and chickens can be replaced with others of the same type (ex: goats for milk instead of cows). Dogs and cats.... I don't think so. Wait.... actually, the ancient Greeks had house snakes instead of cats. Ok, so if you can't find cats, find some non-poisonous snakes and train them. There are snakes in most parts of the world. Dogs..... Any smaller hunting pack animal, but I can't think of any right now...
     
    Last edited: Jan 5, 2020
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  10. Deleted member 155674

    Deleted member 155674 Guest

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    This is a good video blobmelt_thumbs
     
  11. Nargol

    Nargol Evangelist. Candy-san. Pope of the Cult of Pyoo

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    The same way we created the crops we have today.

    Selective breeding to get useful traits.

    I really don't get how our ancestors did this shit tbh. The way they must have done it is so obvious any retard could figure it out. But actually doing it, back then? Over such a long time?
     
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  12. Xane

    Xane Well-Known Member

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    Basically, you can domesticate anything. However just because it's domesticated doesn't mean it's a pet. They'll tolerate your existence and look to you for their food because that's what they've been trained, but they're not companions.

    You need a lot of generations of selective breeding in order to get wolves to the point of dogs in terms of companionship.

    Here's a Russian that did it with foxes. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dmitry_Belyayev_(zoologist)
     
    Last edited: Jan 5, 2020
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  13. Macrendil Ysmir

    Macrendil Ysmir Well-Known Member

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    Chickens would be easiest. Then other birds like geese and ducks. Just fence them in and clip the wings. Provide a lot of food and feathers for arrows & atlatl javelins.
    Sheep and goats are after that. Not too big and can be easily fenced as well. More meat, as well as wool and hides for warmth. And also milk & cheese.
    Wolves will take longer. Yes, if you get a wolf pup you can somewhat tame them by getting them accustomed to human prescence and some basic commans, but they will remain wild animals. You hurt them, they will bite back. True domestication, so wolves becoming dogs, will take centuries of selective breeding for subordiantion and the desired traits (size, strength, endurance & looks).
    Cats domesticate themselves if you have a sufficient rodent problem in agricultural settlements.

    Cows, boar and horses will be last, simply because of their size, strength and skittishnes (horses). Bigger, stronger pens. Start with young ones, slectively breed and take off the horns and tusks every time they grow back to make handling them more safe.
     
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  14. lychee

    lychee [- slightly morbid fruit -] ❀[ 恋爱? ]❀

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  15. Fuwafuwakid

    Fuwafuwakid [HIGH-CLASS POTATO] [BAMBOO MUNCHER]

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    Beat it half dead to establish dominance :blobhero::blobhero:
     
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  16. Exitiumm

    Exitiumm Well-Known Member

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  17. Miserys_End

    Miserys_End 「Lv1 Pretend Person」I'm the preson i pretend to be

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    *starts domesticating wild prehistoric animals*
    Yup yup! In just a few thousand year I'll turn these velociraptors into chickens, those direwolves over there into sheepdogs and that pack of sabertooth tigers into tabby cats....
     
  18. Deleted member 155674

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    Reverse Jurassic Park :hmm:
     
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  19. Miserys_End

    Miserys_End 「Lv1 Pretend Person」I'm the preson i pretend to be

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    No doubt it will be just as intense in the beginning and slowly dwindle into obscurity as the original....
     
  20. Ai chan

    Ai chan Queen of Yuri, Devourer of Traps, Thrusted Witch

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    Domesticating animals do not have any set of time requirement. On an individual scale, you can tame an animal to function as a partner in whatever you're planning on using it for in a matter of weeks. Animals have sapience, they understand that there is more than just eating and sleeping as well as the value of cooperation. In the case of pack animals, you need to establish a pack leader-pack follower relationship for it to work.

    Example is a wolf. You can, on your own, 'tame' a wolf. To do this, you must first establish yourself as the pack leader and the wolf as your pack follower. What does that mean? That means, you establish dominance first, you take everything for yourself, and then you hand out stuff to them, just like in the wilds. In the wilds, the alpha takes everything it wants for itself, then leave the carcass behind for the rest of the pack to munch on.

    This may sound cruel if it happens in human society, but it is the natural order in the animal world. You cannot treat them as human, they do not understand your sentimentality. If you act soft with them, like feeding them first before you have a meal, you have shown them that THEY are the alpha, not you. In the case of wolves, it can easily turn on you the moment it feels your weakness because it wants the position of alpha. You've probably heard of people who got attacked by their own wolf or tiger pets, that's because they didn't establish their dominance over the wolf or tiger.

    Domesticating takes a much longer time than simple individual taming. In the case of herbivores, they naturally flock to humans because humans have a lot of food. And unlike living in the wilds, they have this false sense of security that if they stay near humans, they won't have to run away from predators. Sure, we eat them too, but the scale of time of their thoughts are different from us. Humans think in the decades, animals think in the day, or week. To them, being able to graze in peace without having to run for their lives every single day is already a good life. Unlike predators, humans do not disturb them when they're eating or sleeping, so to them, it only makes sense to live with humans.

    As for domesticating carnivores, it also happened over a long period of time. Nobody knows how long. If we're talking about dogs, the theory was, that sometime in the past, humans domesticated them by chance by just being humans. We were better hunters than dogs, and unlike dogs/wolves, we almost always get a kill due to our ability to use tools and make traps. What this means is, we have a lot of food, and the stuff we considered trash such as bone marrow or tough muscles could be their food. So instead of wasting energy hunting for prey that might've run away, they waited for our scraps because that was a sure meal for them. For the humans, they knew that dogs were faster and can detect prey better, so perhaps after the first fear, they decided to try out using the dogs in hunting. Over time, humans and dogs developed a symbiotic relationship based on complimentary strengths, allowing both of them to hunt better.

    It's hard to say which is most important. The donkey was pretty useful as pack animal. The horse has been very useful as both pack animal and transport. The cattle has been very useful as food, mount and agricultural equipment, not to mention their hides are the most commonly used. The pig has been very useful as food stuff mostly because they eat anything, so medieval people loved keeping one of them because feeding them and fattening them is very easy. The dog has been very useful as companion and hunting assistance. If Ai-chan were to choose one though, it would be the cattle, because Ai-chan is a beef lover.
     
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