this has been on my mind for awhile now and i need to get it out when r*pe is used as a plot device instead actually developing the relationship through character development and is never mentioned again and the victim (which is usually the bottom lbr) still falls in love w the r*pist (i'm ok w r*pe in fiction IF it's portrayed as something bad and isn't romanticized) female characters have no personality other than being bitchy and two faced, are there to get in between the couple, or non existent. in the rare cases that girls are supportive of the couple they are portrayed as these creepy fangirls who fetishise the main cp. sigh when het roles are placed on a mlm couple and the bottom is seen as the "girl" in the relationship and is referred to as "wife". i get that translating into another language and keeping the original meaning but it still makes me cringe, sorry. if i wanted to read m/f i would read shojo the fans it attracts. don't get me wrong i enjoy bl but some fans take it to the extreme and are creepy about it. if you're gawking @ gay men in public and writing fics about your irl male friends you need to take a step back. is there anything about bl that you dislike?
I'd say I have a problem with the very same things. Although #1 and 2 are more or less the same in many het romances. Adding onto that, another thing I dislike is scenarios like forced marriage and stuff but that mostly plays into #1 again. Oh, and, the ones with no development in the relationship department but smut every three paragraphs.
I agree 100%! My dog has heard me rant about all of those things before. The third one is a serious pet peeve of mine. Especially when the bottom is just like a weaker, lesser version of the top in every way; seems to be defined solely by his position is bed; has traditionally "girly" qualities/hobbies/etc and is referred to as "wifey". It all seems to be just an ingrained belief that "bottoming in mlm relationships makes you less of a man" and I HATE THAT SO MUCH.
I also concur. 1. -> I actually don't have a huge problem with this. I recognize that it is problematic and unrealistic. However, I also enjoy it (as a fictional fantasy) within certain limits. 2. -> Absolutely. I agree. A great and rare counter-example was the character of Ivana in the supermodel arc of FOD. I loved her character to death. 3. -> It also sets my teeth on edge when the uke/shou is suddenly referred to as "wife". In some settings and contexts, this works. At other times and most often, it is grating and pulls me out of the story. 4. -> I do not have personal first hand experience with this type of fan. I do find it amusing when those crazy fujoshi fans are referred to or exists *within* a BL story itself. ^^ But yes, ideally, the couple (or thruple, or w/e configuration you prefer) would all be interesting 3D characters in their own right. Without needing to be pushed into hetero-normative roles, and supported by a cast of intelligent and interesting side characters. Btw, If you want to read something with amazing scenes of intimacy that fully include consent and taking into account each character's level of comfort and experience -- also with a nice array of couples and supporting characters-- I highly recommend Heavenly Soul over at scribblehub.
What I hate about BL? I guess it would be the penises touching. Lol sorry, I'm straight, sorry for barging into this thread. haha
*jumps on the rage train* The 1st and 3rd irk me the most. I specifically have sth to say about the first: I get that rape happens so naturally it's no wonder it's present in stories but for god's fucking sake, what's with all the couple rape?!?? If someone rapes you, you wouldn't normally fall in love with them afterwards, right? And you wouldn't just gloss over it like it didn't bother you at all and then just proceed interacting with that person like before. Like XD There's this novel I read https://www.novelupdates.com/series/hako-no-naka/ which is pretty dark. If you don't want spoilers about it, don't open this one ↓ Spoiler: You've been warned The reason why I'm mentioning this here is cause the ML raped the MC twice. Once even more or less in front of a couple of other people. The author doesn't really excuse it and lets you understand the reasons for it (being that the ML has the emotional development of a fucking infant and doesn't even have basic empathy yet) so you get why but it's still incredibly irritating!! Like of course the MC also has his reasons for eventually getting together with the ML and in the extras it actually seems like in the following years and decades the ML develops empathy and they have consensual sex but god. I get it but still (╯°□°)╯︵┴─┴ If you can't respect someone's wishes, I'd very much doubt the thing you call "love" is worth much. Like fucking *yeets all those self-absorbed MLs into space* XD ugh shit yeah I just had to rant about this haha ^^' and I know in that novel why the ML is that way.. like I know why but WHYYYYYY (#`皿´) XDD gosh, if yanno what I mean xD
It's why I've come to absolutely despise ABO worlds. It's literally a world made for raping and victim blaming.
https://www.novelupdates.com/release-filtering/ You just have to hide yaoi and shounen so genres to do the trick
yeah, that's also what I thought of when I read that paragraph. Ivana is great aaaaahhhhhhhhhhh (≧∀≦) so much support~ I love Heavenly Soul to bits
For me one thing that comes up a lot in BL novels (also appears in BG, but maybe to a slightly lesser extent) that I do *NOT* enjoy is the following: When the 'seme/gong' partner gets super possessive and controlling, and won't let their partner so much as smile at other people. Because their partner's social, emotional, and all other needs can only be met by them. Even worse if that partner is all like "ooooh, I don't mind that they are so controlling. Look how in love with me they are! Social life? What is that? Can you eat it?". This is seriously not ok. Not even in a fictional story. Honestly, that puts me off the pairing. Hard NO on my part.
It is true that works on the NU series that are properly tagged, but it does nothing for the ScribbleHub spam links on the right side of the page or forum title links at the top of the page. I use uBlock Origin to completely delete the scribblehub sidebar, but I haven't done that with forum thread links (otherwise I would have never seen this thread).
Honestly, that's most chinese romance novels out there. BLs and hets, they're not that different in general.
Yea I find it weird when I read bl too. Especially the wife calling. Just seems so weird when I encounter it.
The Uke (bottom) is way too feminine and no manly characteristic... It's alright to make the uke cute, but they should remain their masculinity or they have at least more towards male more than female (better explanation, characters like; Ciel [Kuroshitsuji], Misaki [Junjou Romantica], Teito[Seven Ghost] and etc etc) Feminine male characters like: Kuro [Kuro Maid-sama (I think that's the title, something like that)], Both cutie ukes from Otokonoko Delivery and etc etc..I dislike these characters...
Oh yes, that as well. And the constant down-talking of their partner. The "best" example of that to me is Legendary Master's Wife. I liked the story for the plot but finally stopped reading because of the gong. Like, every second or third chapter, he'd tell the MC what an idiot he is. Yeah, excuse me but if you've lived 10k+ years while the other is below 30, there's a high chance your wealth of experiences doesn't line up. Get over it already! Otherwise, that's just a downright abusive relationship to me.
I pulled five out of a hat. It's not the end of the world, just kind of annoying sometimes. Can also be applied to a lot of het. so... Virgin MC has their first time with ML and despite the fact they've never so much as masturbated the MC is somehow incredible at sex. 100% bonafide platinum virgin. Has magically managed to never watch porn. Hasn't even touched his own penis let alone anyone else's. When it comes to the bedroom = skill of a god-tier prostitute. Wut. Uke might as well be a woman. He's a girl in every aspect aside from the fact he has a penis. I don't actually mind this sometimes. Sometimes. Not 2/3 titles. You rape me, I love you! Now I don't mind rape fantasies. They're not my thing, but they are a thing and that's okay. It's a bit hard for me to get into a story when it asks for suspension of disbelief with this particular plot device though. Maybe it's because I used to work with rape survivors and witnessed the carnage it leaves behind. Helping men, women and children heal from sexual assault isn't sexy in real-life. Spoiler None of them fell in love with the FL/ML Controlling and possessive leads. I think some jealousy in an ML is cute. Going so far as to forbid you from breathing in another person's direction? Not so much. Even less enthused with the idea of imprisonment as punishment for interacting naturally with other people. Boring Bad Guys. They're supposed to be all evil and malevolent but have the abilities of a 7 year old throwing a tantrum. Or they're just unrelentingly evil without any sufficient explanation of why. I'd like to know what made them that way. Were they born that way? Nurtured? What? So much cannon fodder, so little time...
the main problem w girly uke/shou is that being feminine is their only personality trait and only exist to be the gong's/seme's hole. i don't mind top's who get jealous and are pushy but when they get manipulative it's a hard pass.
Agree. I think those kind of flat uke/shou types are...insubstantial? I don't need it to be detailed, but at least create a proper character. Also agree with jealous tops. It can be played out great for tension/dynamic, but sometimes it gets to the point where I'm wondering if the seme/gong is going to start murdering people - starting with the uke/shou.