Discussion To kill or not to kill?

I mean yeah the raping was pretty bad.

 

I think I get more annoyed when the author introduces an irrationally aggressive idiot to attack the MC. Forced plot punching bags are a dime a dozen in all genres and they are the worst crap ever. Like, how do these worlds even function with so many deranged lunatics running around getting into life or death fights with every man and his dog over just slightly being near them? Such lazy writing!

I hate murder hobos and beta hobos though. If you are in the middle of the forest and some person tries to murder you? Mess em up, MC! I hate that whole beta 'let someone WHO IS CLEARLY OUT TO GET YOU go' because reasons.

1. If you kill them you will be just like them! BAH! Such idealistic, wishy-washy logic used by people too weak to make a choice. It's so easy to hide behind our high horse when you have cheat powers.
2. Pull them up by the weeds and roots! Calm down you idiot, rather than murdering 7 generations of their bloodline, try talking first. Reach a damn compromise if you have to before deciding to murder all their family, the kids and the elderly, guilty, innocent, good, evil and whatnot. Fucks sake they only looked at you sideways!

EDIT: bonus points for #2 if the entire reason the MC is on his crusade is because someone did exactly that to his family. "I'm noble and just for killing 7 generations of their family, but they are the bad guys for doing it to me because I didn't do anything wrong!"

 

I am having questions on the bonus part, like, if the opposition actually murdered my entire family, I will kill off those that participate the act, yes including the vassals who are just following orders, still does not change the fact that my family's blood is on their hands.

But at least I will only go after those who are involved, directly or otherwise. Not those who don't know the operation or those that actually oppose it. And if those who are involved willing to commit suicide in front of me, I am fine with just letting the rest of their familiez off.

But yes, the bottom line will be to kill off those that are involved and I will understand that I am just as bad as these bastards and we can probably be cell mates in hell.

My question is, would you kill those involved? Because I am confused on the portion of you berating on killing the entire family but not mentioning about the perpetrators.

Sure if the family holds the idea of "I am always right, whatever you (MC) do is wrong." Then I might opt for the "cripple/ enslave/ lobotomise all" option.

 

Ah, it was more a jab at self righteous MCs who are happy to murder innocent people just because they are related to someone. Many CN stories have such bloodthirst and I find it funny that an MC pretends to be a good guy when he's just as bad as the other party.

I think it depends on how biased against the MC the world is. Usually the author makes people hate the MC for the most contrived reasons so you have to kill all the mobs in the area to stop more from spawning. Killing people who are irredeemably evil is probably for the best, they will always come back. Get the rest thrown into a prison or mine somewhere. Why let someone go when you know they will just get out of prison and try and kill your granny and even her dogs and chickens? Still, depends on how much of a hateboner the world has for you.

If it's a typical xianxia world, you are probably screwed no matter what!

 

True true, I can never understand how much edge the author is making the world.

Sure I am hating the world, but I also understand that a. It isn't all that bad most of the times and b. It is just how I look at things. The whole Fighting Against the World is cool and all, but it gets so tiring, even when I am just reading, why can't you just take a nap or stroll in the local park?

 

I remember a scene from MGA where it even extended to the mc having the pets and even the mice living in the house of an enemy killed.
It was as if the story had taken a full turn into parody of the xuanhuan genre. lol

 

I'm against killing in general, so I wouldn't ever kill anyone. *shrugs*

But as a writer, if I were to depict a character in a situation that they have the opportunity to kill an enemy... Either I'd give them a good reason to let the enemy go, or the enemy would die. A character that is used to killing people should not let the enemy go unless they have a good reason about it.

Using Dragon Ball as an example, Goku lets Piccolo go to save Kami's life. And Goku let's Vegeta go because he wanted to fight Vegeta again, because he saw someone that was much stronger than him and he loves fights and stuff. Both are good in-character reason to let the opponent go away.
OTOH, if they just let the opponent go away because they're merciful or hope the opponent that has shown no morals so far will somehow change their ways, then this is bad writing.
And on yet another counterpoint, if the character is against killing in general, then staying true to their beliefs is also a fine reason. But in that case they must have avoided killing the entire novel and this should eventually lead to some bigger conflict. I believe this once happened to Superman as he faced a group of heroes that didn't like him because he did not kill his enemies, and then he had to show them what would happen if he followed along with their values or something... I never read the comic myself, so I have to make do with what I heard of it, so take that for what it is.

Regardless, the important part is that the character actions feel reasonable and that they are consistent with the character's overall personality and goals. As long as it is made like that, it's fine.

 

To be fair, although chinese novels tend to be very unreasonable sometimes, but for me it will always be better than japanese novels. At this point, anything japanese for me is limited to mangas and animes. Why you may ask ? the unreasonably saint goodytwo shoes white lotus useless mc. I hate them, the japanese white lotus is 1000 times worse than any chinese white lotus. Even when you think the mc is good and smart and all, the white lotus didease kicks in. Ugh. Sometimes it ruins the novel completely. Not to mention recurring jokes about foodies and flat chests, boring. Not even their yanderes and tsunderes are like chinese ones.
The japanese have a serious problem with always wanting to paint themselves in a good light. At some point, they even forget the basis of human emotions and that humans are humans. As you said, everything that's killed is facelees enemies.

 

CN novels tend to kill off villains but they also develop them less in consequence. That's why JP novels, even the worst of them, tend to have well-developed villains, while CN novels have random chaps that failed to see mount tai.

My point being, in JP novels, villains are characters so the authors are reluctant to kill them, but in CN novels, villains are tools who are only here to be killed.

Why, you ask? Because CN most novels play on length and length only. It's about pumping out as many chapters as possible. How do you do that? By giving the audience exactly what they want. Kill the annoying character, bang the girl, buy the palace, beat the strongest, govern the planet.

Except in Reverend Insanity, because it's a good novel.

I mean, how long has it been since there last was a CN that didn't reach a global scale? That used to be a xianxia thing only, now it's everywhere. MC has to go through the whole planet, the whole planet is his playground.

Meanwhile, there are a lot of shitty JP authors, but there are many that will dare to make an interesting novel that takes place in a single appartement.

 

Personally I have more issues with overly murderous mc's than overly pacifistic ones, even if both can be annoying.
One is merely being an idiot while the other is a malicious idiot.
Both types of characters tend to be ones that rely on the plot armor to save the day, sometimes to the point that it seems like the author is self-aware of it but is too lazy to give a crap anyway.

Killing or not killing an opponent depends on what the consequences are, problem is some authors don't give a crap about those and will either find some overly convenient way to negate them afterwards or even fail to consider that there is such a thing as consequences of your actions in the first place.

 

To kill or not to kill?
Well, it really depends on how bad the bad guy is. I am willing to ignore danger to myself and try to give the bad guy chance to redeem himself.
But I am not willing to ignore danger to other people. If the corrupt noble's horrible rule over the commoners will only end with his death, well, he'll get death. If I can get the King to revoke his noble title and lands, that is good enough.

I am also unwilling to give a third chance. If the bad guy has not redeemed himself and started being bad again, well, death will cure him.

In the end, I am not a murderhobo. I am a judge, jury and executioner.

 

I don't care if they are arrogant or annoy me, but if they actions troubles me or makes problems for me, then as long as it will not cause future problems, kill him. Doesn't matter if they are a child, mother or whatnot. If the MC takes joy in bringing pain and torturing people, go for it, I wouldn't really mind. I am generally more into villains and evil characters so that is just the preference for me (but they have to be evil towards everyone and not just against males while worshipping every females). I really can't stand hero of justice.

There is no need to capture, it's a waste of time if you can just take them out right now. I likes more MC who do everything to achieve their goal, letting go of morality and ethics.

 

People in this thread are willing to change others and give them second chances. I can never stand that. If maybe a person did something bad but didn't try to kill you then it's fine, give him a second chance. But if he tried to kill you, then you HAVE to kill him; doesn't matter if he is a child starving or someone that is being forced to do it. If you were not strong enough you would have died, doesn't matter if it wasn't his decision to harm you, he ultimately did, so he shall die. (I am ranting right now)

 

You're like the epitome of every Xianxia MC. XD

 

It might be culture-specific. In my culture, that indicates you are weak and insecure, while true strength comes with ability to forgive.
That is why, I see your approach acceptable to fantasy low-lives, but doesn't fit wish-fulfillment or heroic MC.

 

It's the same in my culture, we are taught to give others almost always a second chance. But this is not reality, it's fantasy, a novel. I don't like it being similar to real life. I may seem to have low standards, the only novel that I ever liked are:

- Reverend Insanity
- Way of the Devil
- Lord of the Mysteries (the mc is a little of a justice seeker, but the story compensate for it)

That is not to say I can't enjoy story with heroic protagonists, but the story, character development, and the plot have to balance out my hate for the MC.

I have read a lot of xianxia, cultivation, scifi... but the only three that ever stick to me are those 3, the rest are all below a 6/10 for me.
I don't like edgy or arrogant mc particularly, I prefer characters who are selfish, I don't mind if they care about their family and friends, but if they also care about complete strangers than that is a turnoff for me.

I don't read xianxia or wuxia anymore, apart from Reverend Insanity (which I absolutely love). I can't enjoy them. Either the enemies that have 0 IQ, the MC always win and never fails, the harem romance where the MC basically cultivate the dao of obtaining wifes, or the typical plot-driven revenge that is stretched out for 2000 chapters- always succeed to annoy me and makes me drop.
I like unethical MCs, but when a character eliminate a clan for no apparent reason, and not just because he likes to kill or what, for literally no reason at all is annoying to me completely. Even worse is when the MC is an hypocrite.

 

I love to solve problems to the root. I'm not that kind of a person that will forgive those that hurt me, so kill.

JP BETA MC are hurt to watch. Eww

That's why I love hxh so much

Gon > Luffy > most JP MC

 

All Xianxia MCs would resort to killing as a solution. Massacres, sects being levelled, chickens and dogs mercilessly killed. You get the gist, that's basically Xianxia. Only the jade white skin ladies with mountainous peaks and phoenix like brows are redeemable in the eyes of a Xianxia MC.

That's why Daoist Gu's MC didn't kill that tranny Bai coz' she's a waifu material.

 

when it come to situations that make life harder for you and endanger you, they need to be solved in the most efficient way, you are no jury as this is ultimately about you and definitely no judge since if you try to justify the actions of others and be fair you'll never be able to progress unless you have the means to guarantee that whatever punishment you're going to give if saw trough, you're the executioner, someone that doesn't care what got the other side into trying to mess with you and only care about whether someone is more valuable to you dead or alive.

 

im somewhat of a pacifist

i dont like hurting others

unless they hurt me enough or threaten those i love

if i had the capability, and whatever done was bad enough, then i may be down to kill them. i can either make em cry or make it painless. factors such as beauty may influence my decisions. depends on many factors.

if im not being hurt someway i dont see why i should hurt them; or why id want to. they are just strangers after all, why should i care? might as well be nice.