I feel like she might go back to sovieshu if heinley turned out worse like he's the villainous demon lord hidden boss that planned everything and planted rasta in the first place hahaha But yeah I kinda sympathized a bit when they were both crying and he finally let navier go (or so we thought), at that point she didn't love heinley yet and they have both realized they loved the other... The story could have turned around at that point which of course makes it so interesting. For sovieshu, I guess the author is trying to give him some redemption with readers by giving him a backstory and circumstances to why he acted like trash, all the while throwing rashta under the bus. To be honest, after reading for so long my hatred for him has died down. If this was some shoujo manga: I guess if heinley does die, and imagine if the war gets prolonged for 10 years or so... when finally there's peace, sovieshu finally knowing what's important to him, giving his position to whoever's next in line, he would package himself as a concubine for the western empire's empress. (The throw away everything for you end) For themes like the scummy guy getting some sort of comeback, check out "the last empress" drama
Spoiler Later Alan will meet Rasta and asked her to acknowledge their son. He asked their son should be treated as quasi prince. As u guys know rasta is the empress and gloriem is the princess. So its kinda unfar for alan's son to be treated as bastard from what he said so.
is it possible for anyone to give me a clear view on the political side of things between the two empires?
The funnny thing was, if it weren't for Sovieshu, Heinley would end up being a villainous character in Navier's story.. He doesn't plan on giving up on her even when she's married to the point that McKenna has no choice but to just give in and advice him to wage war for her (they were going to do it anyways). His aide cautioned that it will make her look bad to the people, so he responded with using Rashta as shield. Then McKenna asked what does he plan to get Navier after that because he can't possibly be thinking to forcibly take her just like that. Heinley's reaction is like "???". He thought he could just do a bird dance cause that's what's birds do. McKenna is like. He knows trust and friendship would be broken first in that plan, but he just sighed and agreed with Heinley. At this point, I realized this smooth socialite also has some few screws missing when it comes to interpersonal relationships and is not that ahead of Navier or Sovieshu. Considering what he said about not having many people to connect with on personal level, I guess he lacked some empathy (which, I guess, is also part of why Duke Elgy said he's a two-face who can smile and stab you at the same time aside from being used to backhanded tactics as his fighting style). So they all have some social problems. But the key difference between the three of them is that Heinley knows what he wants and how to get it (he wasn't raised with the responsibility of being the crown prince that will govern the nation), unlike Navier and Soveishu who were raised not to be individuals, but an efficient vessel/head for their nation which left their individual awareness to be stunted. Both of them didn't even realize they like each other until it was too late. Navier was raised to be selfless (in the sense of not acting for herself when it can get in conflict with national affairs). Soveishu is raised with the idea that everything is his so he could fulfill his responsibility as future king (he's given privilege & power, and has Navi as the reliable partner whose "role" is to support his decisions and match his mindset). It's because they didn't understand their selves and in turn, couldn't communicate it that they fell apart. Sovieshu wanted to feel love and passion, but she's just cold so he put all the blame on her until she cracks. Navier has aloofness and pride as shield that protects her mentality - so the more he attacks her, the more she hides, becomes cold and back away (instead of opening up like he wanted). Heinley's problem never became apparent because of Sovieshu shooting his self in the foot and pushing Navier to him. So I guess Rashta may actually be a heaven-sent angel for Heinley, as she descended on the couple and Sovieshu took a dive in both EQ and IQ. Spoiler What is Heinley planning to do if Sovieshu didn't go for divorce though? It can't possibly be dancing. There's no doubt that she will feel betrayal, but considering that he was honest with her in telling they do have a plan and she was suspicious from it, she'll be prepared. But he'll still be considered enemy of the state so as Empress, she cannot be friends with him. Not to mention that she is actually "in love" with Sovieshu. The decisive reason she fell out with him is with the divorce and when he served her roasted bird w/ blue feathers as sadistic threat. If Heinley tried to propose to her as an enemy King, he'll really have low chances of succeeding. I suppose if he didn't harm her family, treated her citizens with equal respect, and not execute Sovie (just locked up), there'll be a slight chance of being redeemed in her eyes. . . but chances of marriage is still very low unless he use her people as collateral /black mail (in which case she'll just treat it as political sacrifice). So all in all, Heinley is really very lucky.
I will start by saying I love Heinley and I am glad Navier ended up with him. With that said, I want to go into why I actually do think Heinley is not an angel. Heinley mentioned he had two reasons why he worked to build a reputation as a womanizer 1) So he can spy in peace 2) So he won't be seen as capable in comparison to his brother #1 is easy to understand. When he is on a secret mission, he can explain why he is at places easier if people think he is a major playboy, but #2 is less easy to understand. Why do someone not want to be viewed as capable within his own kingdom? Could it be there's a history of kings killing possible threats to power in Western Kingdom? Or is it because he wants people to lower their guards around him so he acts stupid? Or is it because he doesn't want people to realize he is smart and great at magic could have actually helped prolong his brother's life but chose to let him sleep in that magic bed that zap his energy every day? I actually think it may be all three. First reason allows him to live till adulthood peacefully. The second, allows him to weaken his opponents and strengthen his position even before he becomes king. The third, let him legitimately be crowned king asap with least resistance. The second thing I want to point out is that although Rashta was a lucky charm for Heinley, he actually played a few backhand tricks so he can get what he wants (Navier) way more smoothly than otherwise: 1) Early on he chose to fight with Sovieshu over Rashta publicly so that he can divert people's attention from his interest in Navier (Sovieshu would have taken much stricter stance had he realized earlier) 2) He hides his magic talents, going so far as to tell the principle to take his photo off the wall of top graduates, so Sovieshu, Navier, and others don't even consider the possibility he could shape-shift, this allows him to spy in peace and basically appear whenever Navier has a fight with Sovieshu, thus making her more and more emotionally dependent on him 3) He sent his friend Elgy over to Rashta to stir the pot, making her act faster (he needs her to act fast since he knows Sovieshu will tire of her sooner or later), and further separate Sovieshu and Navier 5) He steals magic from Eastern kingdom, equalizing the power between west and east, making Sovieshu more worried about the future and more desperate to get a heir to stabilize the empire's future Now if Rashta didn't exist what would Heinley do? He would probably use other people to start a war. He wouldn't have just marched the arming into Eastern empire out right. He would probably get others to attack him so he can "counter-attack". Then, he would strike Eastern empire down since they have nearly no mages left. Once he is able to take over Eastern empire, he would then offer Navier a choice - she can either step down or she can become his queen and have a chance to keep the people in the ex eastern empire good. Navier, who had always believed in greater good, would have agreed to be his queen, and he then gets a whole life to convince her.
Hi, Heinly's fangirl here! haha I agree with most of your points. Yes, it was mentioned a lot of times that Heinly's a womanizer when he's actually not. That reputation was created for the various reasons you have already mentioned. However, besides being branded a womanizer, he also has a reputation for cruelty and violence. And that reputation is actually deserved. When Navier first met Heinly, she thought that whilst his cruelty might be true, he's most likely not a womanizer. Rashta's maid instinctively felt that he might be a cruel man when she tried to trick him. Later, she was proven to be right. There were hints here and there, mentions by various characters at various times. He has his personal knights who have done really violent things for him and in his name. When he got news of how Navier was being treated, he did vow to make those who abused her kneel in front of her with stones sewn in their mouths. Most recently in episode 156, Duke Elgy went to the slums and beat up Rashta's father. The scene made me realise that Heinly most likely be as violent since both are known as best friends. Evidences of his cruelty, scheming and violence were scattered through out the novel but obscured by his lovey-dovey and rom-com episodes with Navier. Regarding Navier, he accidentally fell in love with her during his spy mission to the Eastern Empire's palace. It wasn't intentional but once he realised it, he didn't try to deny his feelings and instead embraced it whole-heartedly. I think his visits to her wasn't him trying to make her emotionally dependent on him. It's simply because he loves her and wants to be with her. Even if it means comforting her when she's hurt by Sovieshu and accepting her marriage proposal despite knowing that for her it's a just a marriage of convenience. At the end of the day, Heinly is still the consistent and big picture type of guy. He still wants to expand his empire and works at it. His love story with Navier necessitates some detours but the end goal is the same. Mckenna senses that might be an issue with Navier later on and advises him perhaps to focus on strengthening his empire internally and leave the conquering to his descendants. Navier's parents also cautioned him that there might be a time that there will be a conflict between his role as a husband and as an emperor. Even Sovieshu (JERK!!) mentioned that he'll be waiting to get back with Navier once she realises the truth about Heinly (just NO!). Navier isn't stupid. She's starting to realise the various facets of Heinly's personality and noted that he does treat her differently. I hope both are able to accept each other's strength and weaknesses and be together until the end. Even though I'm not sure how they can compromise on war with the Eastern Empire, I hope they do find a way. The Eastern Empire is declining anyway and will sooner or later implode by itself. All the Western Empire needs to do is wait by the side to pick up the pieces.
Eastern Empire Very rigid social structure. Therefore the relationship between the nobles and commoners have become quite strained, though not quite pre-French or Russian revolution level. As for the imperial family, even though very powerful, it seems to have a feudal type of relationship with the nobles, especially the high nobles like the Troby family. The nobles were given lands and in turn, they provide the emperor with his armies. That's why empresses come from from the high noble families so that the imperial family could benefit from the relationship. Unfortunately, the powerful nobles can create a lot of trouble for the emperor.It seemed that only the mage army is directly under the control of the emperor and his main source of power. The powerful magic is the advantage that the empire has over other kingdoms/empires in the continent. That's why Heinly and Elgy had to play the long game of decreasing the powers and number of wizards in the Eastern Empire. Even though the emperor is powerful, there's a check and balance to his power besides the nobles ie the church. The imperial family itself isn't stable. The emperor has no heir. The throne is eyed by Duke Lilteang for his young son. Once the Rashta factor comes in, the reputation of the imperial family deteriorated. She managed to anger both nobles and commoners. Seems ripe for a revolution.All in all, the empire seems to be declining in every way and the imperial family is trouble. Western Empire The social structure seemed more fluid compared to the eastern empire. The richest empire in the continent, even more than the eastern empire. The royal family is extremely wealthy. Has a powerful calvary and infantry army directly under the control of the emperor. As such, there are lesser noble families in the empire compared to the Eastern Empire and they are less able to threaten the emperor. Their only weakness is the lack of mages in the empire, which resulted them losing to the Eastern Empire in a previous war. However, Heinly's late brother was a weak king-i think politically too besides physically. He has weakened various aspects of the government. He allowed the nobles to become more powerful and by the time Heinly took the throne, they have already became quite unruly and arrogant. I think Wharton lll left a lot of the ruling to Christa (since he had a few concubines on the side) and as a result, her family seemed to conquer various important positions in the government. Heinly's problem is the nobles relating the Christa rebelling against him. It's not a problem an emperor who plans on going to war wants to face. That's how I understand it. I hope it helps.
Just to clarify, I'm not saying Heinley is an angel. I just found it funny that Heinley's position and character is usually that of villainous 2nd MLs that fell in love with the heroine and usually get rejected for ML(w/c are usually characters like Sovieshu - emperor, got all her firsts, "misunderstood" actions that was done ultimately for her sake trope). Rashta is certainly the lucky charm in Heinley's life. Without her, I think he will indeed go down the war route to get Navier and then try to make it up to her afterwards. Though I don't think it'll be as successful without Rashta for following reasons: Spoiler 1. Navier got close with Heinley because Rashta and Sovieshu combo had made cracks on her iron wall. He had managed to slip through the cracks by finding her when she's most vulnerable and cheering her up. Thus raising his status to a dear friend. She had not enough problems to the point of breaking down prior Rashta. There's not a big enough crack for Heinley to establish a footing in her heart. At most, he'll be on the same level as Duke Kapmen in terms of importance. 2. She's unknowingly in love with Sovieshu. And she is pretty loyal as long as there wasn't any reason not to be. She's most loyal to her work though. As long as she's in love with Sovieshu, Heinley can never have her heart even if he managed to make her forcefully marry him. Actually, such actions may actually be what push her to realize her feelings for Sovieshu in that scenario. Rashta is the catalyst that broke this connection and love that leaves space for Heinley to enter. 3. Heinley cannot win for sure with the war against the Eastern Empire (especially if the Emperor and Empress are working together harmoniously) - much less make a demand to have the empress as his wife. The Eastern Empire is the most powerful country with Western kingdom being second. Even with the dwindling mages, they still have the army which is also under control of Navier's family. If war broke out, her family will be in danger and if any of them die because of him, then she'll close herself from him. Heinley may be cunning along with Duke Elgy, but Navier proved she can catch on their plans if she paid attention to it (like how she found out they're from bird-headed tribe). Sovieshu was actually competent prior meeting Rashta. The problem with lack of mages may also be solved with making alliances with other countries such as Rwibt. So the war is 50/50 as it depends on situation. 4.Navier places importance on pride and dignity. Such a brazen demand will be like a slap on her face as it's not only ruining the dignity of the emperor and royalty, but also ruining her reputation. In case Heinley managed to spin the offer in a way that it's not offending by using situations and such, and on the less likely chance she accepted, she will not love him as she's still in love with Sovie unless he does something really stupid. An empress marrying into another country king can be seen as betrayal (she only did so out of desperation from the divorce). Sovieshu will also do everything he can to stop Navier from leaving as there's no concubine or baby affecting his senses. For these reasons, Heinley will have a hard time winning Navier over without Rashta. He cannot win unless Sovieshu let go first or died. Rashta is the perfect combination of stupidity, greed, and charm to become the calamitous beauty that served as key in tripping over an empire and extracting the Empress from it. PS: I was under the impression that Heinley is maintaining low profile to avoid the succession war and lower people's guard. Spoiler I don't think he's intentionally letting his brother die to take the throne because on his POV at the death scene he did say that even if they are not bossom friends, they are still on good terms. It's to the point he choose to honor his death wish and stops himself from killing his wife despite how much he wants to. Heinley may be bad, but he's good to those who he consider important (Duke Elgy and McKenna might protest this point though). Iirc, his dream along with McKenna is to make the Western Kingdom great, not become a great king. He's willing to use any means necessary and people for that. If there's a king who can do it, then he'll support him. If there's none, then he'll be the one to lead it. That's the impression I got, unless I missed some spoiler where he intentionally let his bro die. He most likely anticipated his death though and that he'll be the only one left available for the throne..
Fun question to all: How much do you think Heinley and Elgy trust each other? How deep is their friendship? (can you consider it a friendship?)
but guys stupidshoe actually wasn't that stupid -how ironic- he knew she (trashy) would obviously be a terrible empress! Isn't that why he had planned to only let her be empress for one year?! It was just for the child to have legitimate status right? also im pretty sure in that one year she was going to have was gonna be in name only...like no one will expect a pregnant woman to take care of such burdens, will they?
And did not explain it properly with the most important people, and take the steps to ensure that they would both be ok with the arrangement, and not mess things up.
I know that Soveishu's personality is trash but I just can't help but like him. Everytime I read the novel I find myself waiting for Soveishu's appearance. I want Soveishu to suffer, regret, and kept on begging Navier to come back but I also want them to be together. I feel like Soveishu's kindness towards Rashta is actually towards the child she's carrying and that Soveishu's true love is Navier. Since Navier haven't yet fell in love with Heinley she's trying to forget her feelings for Soveishu and try to love Heinley.
As of right now, she hasn’t realized her feelings or accepted it but very close to. She doesn’t love Sovieshu anymore, not after he abandoned her, it’s just not how feelings work. She also saw very stark difference between the treatments and wondered is this how Rashta felt. His kindness towards Rashta initially was not towards the child but rather her pitiful being that boosted his ego. He gifted Navier very rare ring and Navier just said what ring it was and asked what was the reason, compared to shining eyes of Rashta and her never ending praise. He also accused Navier of having no sympathy because she didn’t flatter his concubine, he has some loose screws in his head to do that... You can like him, you can hope for different outcome, but it will not change how he treated Navier and how he broke her heart. I also like to see his regret but I want to see it more. He turned into a better character, I don’t have an itch to slap whatever the crap is in his head anymore because he is doing stupid shit, he is showing signs of conscience albeit not enough to become a good character without regretting part.
There's a saying that said divorce makes a man a better husband. I think that's true in this case, but that doesn't make his earlier action more forgivable. I am glad Navier never goes back to him after he humiliated her time and time again to save his own face. Also, Sovieshu had years to be a better husband, and the best he could do was two dinner together a week and blame her for not being affectionate? Next to Heinley, it's so easy to see all his flaws. Heinley put in a lot of effort to spend time with her, he is so open about his thoughts, and if he was put in a situation where one of them has to be publicly humiliated, he would put himself out there and shield her.
There are no spoilers if there are no new chapters. Only 2 chapters a week, don’t expect shit ton of spoilers and only spoilers when the audience gets this invested in the story when we like to have lengthy discussions and “what ifs”. Chapter 157. Spoiler Rashta getting blackmailed. Again. By her biological father this time. It turned out he has bought out his freedom long ago and is not a slave anymore. He decided to leave Rashta with Roteschu’s son because she was doing great there. And Navier said that it would be good to have twins who will resemble them both... She realized she will love her child regardless of how many problems they will cause, so she is fine with a child being a prankster like Heinley was or calm and obedient kid she was.
Groan! Only 2 episodes per week. Chapter 157- lovely picture of Heinly and Navier. Love the scenes with both of them and McKenna LOL. But too short
While we can make a new discussion thread, i wonder if it'll be better to just create another spoiler thread where we copy-paste all the spoilers from here to there for easier viewing purposes. (Edit: There are already 57 pages worth of posts here anyways. Kinda hard to filter too). A mere discussion thread kinda hinders you from talking about spoilers or comments with it (as there may be people who don't want to read spoilers). Having a new discussion thread to pin spoiler posts from here might be more efficient. This thread is more a combination of spoilers and discussion thread anyway. We talk about the spoilers here when available, and speculations/opinions about the story without worrying about spoiling it for anyone (since everyone in this thread is fine with spoilers).
The forum rules do not approve of double threads. People bitching about “too many pages” are not gonna bother anyway, come to the wrong thread and complain about too many pages. Or start discussion in the spoiler-only thread. Maybe we could have spoilers collected somewhere like sharing service but I don’t know any outside of google drive.
The problem is we are mixing spoilers in our discussions. A lot of stuff we are talking about hasn't been translated yet.
Umm hello? Open your eyes and see that beg red SPOILER on the thread name? This is not last chapter discussion, this thread is specifically about SPOILERS.