Can authors get an adsense share and end the copyright war?

Ads doesn't work like that...
Nobody would pay $1 just to make a single person watch their products or visit their websites...
And not to mention ads will worth less on repeated visit. It doesn't that much different watching between 5 or 50 ads.

 

How many more people need to point out that consent isn't free.

You realise that the majority of people seeing these ads aren't people willing to pay a fraction of a cent, right?
You realise the worth of an ad depreciates each time it's displayed to the same audience, right? How many ads you willing to watch for one chapter? You're okay with watching more ads in this forecast?
You realise being too targeted will limit the range of ads shown and increase the likelihood of the same ad being shown repetitively, right?
You realise this means authors/translators will have to do the same amount of work for less each time, right?

Le me give you a proposal: on your 2nd day of work, I'll pay you less than your 1st day. On your 3rd day of work, I'll pay you less than your 2nd day, and we'll keep dropping it until you're paid in cents. By the way, your workload is never changing. If you don't invest extra time outside of your work hours to improve, get ready for earfuls daily on top of your workload. Sound enticing? This is what you're suggesting.

You want real life examples? I wanted a click that does it's thing while people read. Of 900 people, 76 clicked on a good day. But you know what? There's a demand for more chapters.

And we're using kakao and webtoon as examples? How many sites even come close to their size?

 

.....
well~
first of all to make idea author get ads sense and get live from it you need a site that have wide audience and big enuf for it guaranteed there will be always ads income~ example look no further da prime example is youtube~
why?
it quantity of ads, cuz there soo many ads on sooo many videos with sooo many people access at same time those who use ads block become meh~

another problem is copyright, hello if you put work on that kind of sites it usually exist term of condition~ you can see youtube toc of you interested with adssense income~

well moral huh~ perhaps best case aggregator take real translator work without consent~ hmmm yup that similar~
hmm copyright war is not that simple, wait actually kinda simple only matter who hold it and to what extent~ term and condition~

hmmm if you learn simple legal contract or experience work that binded by legal contract you will understand such concept


@Wujigege is your plan for ads share still going? you can teach op one or two thing about difficulty of implementation no?

 

I seconded this! 

It's possible. But at this point, the author usually could not simply 'notify' the copyright holders. As stated by the quoted post above, the author usually has given a portion of their own right, namely ''copyright', to the right holders. It was usually given in exchange of monetary compensation. I believe that the copyright holders has more weight regarding in this situation.

Then there will be the long process of negotiations, formulation of contract, lawyers for finalizing agreements, and etc. The administrational cost itself would be quite expensive. If the right holders are not charity or acting in a ''charity"-like spirit, i see little to no chance that this idea would get an "ok".

Broadly speaking, a translation work is owned by the translator. Like how author hold rights over their work, so does translator--it's because in the process of translation, there's a creative process to change, interpret, and concretely put ideas into a tangible form. So yes, a work based on a translation should technically ask the permission of the said translator.

But, the right of translation works is heavily related to the original work's author's right, and the right holders could ask the translator to stop publishing their translation. Yet if the right holders would like to use this existing translation works by the translator in official capacity, a discussion need to be held.


This is not a legal advice btw. And law varies from country to country.

Regarding Kakao and Naver...well, they are big corporations. I think they simply could afford the cost of copyrights, even without relying on ads . It's not a pretty good examples in this case.

 

He is not asking he is demanding with a conceited tone when he knows absolutely nothing about ads.
Anyone with the basic knowledge will not even talk about Adsense.
They will talk about Google Ad Manager.

You cannot teach a student who considers himself an expert before the first lesson

How do you reason with someone with their head so far up their ass that they think 200,000 views earns $200,000?

 

Eagerly waiting for those 200,000$. They should come any minute now.

 

I don't think that 200,000 views would earn 200,000$ automatically. I'm thinking it's possible! if half those people stuck to the novel till the very end that maybe they'd be willing to pay 1$ each to support the author and translator or watch ads equivalent to that (not a donation). I don't see how it's so wrong when people pay to purchase coins on Qidian and webtoons.com all the friggin time. My idea is to simply cheapen that fee so more people will do it. Especially people who're used to reading for free (not in the original country) .And thanks for the teachings master !

 

I think what you don't understand is that 200,000 views doesn't translate into 200,000 people. If you have tens or hundreds of chapters, 200k lifetime views more probably translates into 2000 people, because each chapter is considered a 'view'. Wuxiaworld doesn't have any novel that has 200,000 people reading it (holy shit pinch me I'm beginning to daydream). Then factor in the number who would actually be willing to pay, and yeaaaa...

 

$200k for 200k views only possible for hard paywall that cost you exactly $1 to get access to the novel. It's more than 1000x the actual ads networks pay to their publishers. It's not possible with ads because no advertisers would be willing to pay $1 for a single ads click.

If you're talking about cheapen paywall cost, there are emerging web technologies that works better for this. It currently in development and enables website owners to implement content subscription with only a few line of JavaScript code as well a single HTML header tag, called Web Monetization API. Right now its use case only about monthly subscription model. It's cheaper than common website subscription since users only have to pay once and it works across websites that support it, but the revenue isn't that much compared to ads as it's not yet officially implemented in browsers and right now its users only consist of early adaptors and people who were experimenting with it. But at the very least, it's use cases work better for websites that rely on repeated visit users compared to ads, and it's open standard API nature means that people can actually code their own use cases beyond its original use (as an example, I made one library for sharing revenue with it here).

 

Sorry to bother, but can you explain this part?Why would it work better with repeated visits? (Yes I know now ad income = virtually 0, unless you're a very big site). But this script would create a paywall for a series to be accessible with 1$ maybe after 10 or 20 chapters. But why would it be better for repeated visits?

 

Not gonna lie, people vastly overestimate how much worth they generated by aquating it to how much work they put into it
This is not how it works

How much worth you generated is decided by how much someone else is going to pay for it

usually novels are in the category entertainment

So people have to decide, how much they are willing to pay for that entertainment (and that´s somehting people don´t need, just wan´t)

So lets say you write a novel and price it for 10bucks (because you think its worth this much)
So the buyer has to decided between every option thats worth around this money, time and enjoyment, unless the book is extraordinary, I read it once, which means for me a ususal 10€ book is around 6-10 hours worth of entertainment (some other stuff like quality and so on will play into it aswell)

So what else can i get for that amount of money/time/enjoyment ratio

Netflix account/Prime, paid Games, free games, music, fan fiction, another book/novel, ...

And that´s just stuff in the same entertainment category for me, not even everything else i can do with 10bucks
That´s what you are competing against, and in most cases the prices people want for their stuff are simply not worth it

I don´t mean that in a negativ way, maybe the price you want for your stuff is fair for enough people, I´m just saying in my experience it usually isn´t

Obviously this isn´t universally true and there are flaws into this, but it´s good enough to give a rough outline

Edit: I just wrote this, because from what i have read, people didn´t consider this point and i think it should be included, especially if people throwing money as a argument around

 

It's already being mentioned here several times - ads will pay less for regular visitors.

 

You proved my point.
You are not asking questions. You are making demands because you think you know better and it's possible.
Why does Webnovel.com drop novels if making $200,000 is so possible?

This statement describes you perfectly :
I have a rich friend, so everyone must have a rich friend also
Educate yourself, please.
How successful is the average Qidan author? Not the few superstars that you know.
How successful is an average Korean online novel author?
What is the profit margin for the publishing industry?
Why are so many Korean web content platforms funded by the government?

Educate yourself, please.
You are arrogant and completely unaware of how ignorant you are.

Instead of coming on here to show your none existent knowledge, humble yourself and talk to platform owners eg the owner of J-novel club like I did.

Why did ADV go bankrupt?
When you can answer that last question then you will know how stupid your thread really is.

As the Chinese say:

Have eyes but can't see Mt. Tai

 

Who am I making demands to? I asked if it was possible that authors make money from people overseas since they would be more than people actually reading the novel in the novel's own country only. Yes like Qidian and webtoons and crunchroll that seeks to give creators a share in international readers. Nice users (not you) have pointed out that for small sites ad revenue is virtually nothing. And that views don't equal people willing to pay. So I asked again what if it was a really low fee like 1 dollar for a whole novel? Would that give the author a better share than other platforms who demand alot?

All those were questions, I did not demand anything of anyone as you may claim. I believe you may be living in your Chinese novels where you met the arrogant young master, your genius self is trying to teach a lesson to.

Wither this thread is pointless or not, no one forced you to come here and comment on it. Not that you did! You only came in for a personal attack on me bec. you were so appalled by the thread and how I talk.

Again no one forced you to read it or comment! If you have something to say regarding the topic then cool. If not then please leave.
I'm aware I'm naive and not-knowledgeable and that's why I ask questions and form discussions. If you think this is base to ridicule someone then I have nothing to say to you.

There are many people on this thread who were way more knowledgeable than you. Who spoke about algorithm and creating a paywall script. And not one of them was as mean as you.

And if you say you've met people like me before, then so have I. People who think they can ask what they want, but when others do it, then it's a waste of time and how dare they waste the greats time. Wake up and realize that there will be people smarter than you. People who know how to retort and that you will be ridiculed as you've ridiculed me.

 

This is a fair question! One issue that's easy to overlook is how that $1 will actually travel from the reader to you. You need a payment processor. Stripe as a mainstream example charges a flat $0.30 fee per transaction, plus 2.9%, and other processors are similar. That leaves you with $0.70, which then needs to be split between the translator/English platform and the author. So, in general, it isn't practical to price anything in the region of $1 (ideally not even lower than $5).

There are ways to mitigate this – you could offer a $5 bundle to buy five series for example, but that requires you to have five series with substantial content (remember, we're talking about small sites), and defeats the purpose of this system, which is to try and only charge an insignificant amount. Plus it doesn't change the fact that many readers simply don't have an income or payment methods, and so will not be able to pay regardless of how low the price is.

Another point is how you would generate revenue sustainably. Novels don't tend to perpetually gain new readers at a constant rate. If you've translated 500 chapters of a 2000 chapter novel and it stops picking up new readers, what happens? You can't stop translating it because you've sold readers the right to read the "whole" novel, but now you're stuck with 1500 remaining chapters that you need to translate for little additional gain, and not much to pay the author/rights holder with.

There are of course also the other problems people have already outlined here – that the rights are held by the publishers rather than the authors, and the publishers will (in general) only deal with established companies. A lot of work is required from both parties in the licensing process, and the publishers need to be confident that they aren't wasting their time, and that they're giving these rights to a company that will generate them returns.

 

the summary of the thread
Notice me author sensei, I am your international reader. You see, it is because of me that the translator can fucking pay you, although I read the translation for free, and refuse to pay the translator, but hey! I am reading your work! So you need to be grateful and write more fucking books.
end summary.

 

This is quite an eye opener. the length of the novels that could go 6000+ chapters. That would still have to be translated because the subscribers were promised even if alot lost interest. And I believe the very crucial payment method. coz I think people want to support even minors but they usually don't have cr. cards or means to pay even if they did have the money. Which is why I suggested the ads thing. But that got bombed pretty fast.

And the copy right holders demanding and upfront big fee.
This reminds me kinda of the situation with Anime in general. Where many mangakas and animators are underpaid.

And where even if the show was licensed, they only get a one time fee.
Then you find 4+ streaming platforms that each holds different series and everything on the free one(Crunchroll) is regionally restricted after a while.

And then the animators are still poor....

I don't think anybody who loves fiction and spends much time on it, would imagine (if they haven't seen.) that despite the huge popularity and followers. That it's very probable many would barely make ends meet.

I feel bad I ever thought it'd be an easy/fun career to be an author/webtoonist.

 

For micropayments $1 or less the most viable option is to use Interledger protocol. It's great for content tipping and small amount of donation, but since it's a rather new technology, the only use case that currently being used in production is Web Monetization subscription. Interledger based payment processor or tipping app might pop out in the next few years since they're currently picking grant awardees to develop the ecosystem around it, so it might worthwhile to watch out for its development.

 

Saw this the other day.

 

There's no easy answers.