Discussion Grades discrimination?

Well, I've been reading BG novels continuesly this week. This rarely happens as this gurl is 100% Fujoshi.

But for some reason I've been fond of normal school life romance.

I know every country have there own culture a d norms. I'm an anime lover before and read countless Japanese manga.

Grades are important. Though Japanese lean more on disciple and self dependency, there culture is really admirable.

I don't know about Korean, but Im kind of curious about Chinese academic culture.

Or...is it just a norm within Chinese school life romance novel. I know how important education is, but I don't like how these novels discriminate students because of their grades.

I experienced teachers wrath before. I've been humiliated by teachers infront of the whole.class many times before. But that's because I'm hard headed, stubborn and playful kind of student. I even experienced being placed in an isolated sit because of my jokes. But my teachers still compromised with me and put me in front to watched my move very closely.

That's right in our country, students relucantly sit in front where the teacher is. In fact we don't have particular sitting arrangement. Some teachers like arranging students but not by their grade but by their attitude and behavior. Like me, I was always place in front so that I can behave.

Thinking about it, it became a habit. Until I graduated college I still sit in front. (〒﹏〒)

Well, anyways. Also about parents. Does parents in Chinese really do this often? I know parents like to boast their child's achievements. My mother also did it often and it's embarrassing. She keep pushing me to attend several contests when I was young.

I.protest very much cause I don't want to. She insisted to the point of making me choice. She said, attend the contest or I'm grounded for a day. And I happily chose to be grounded. Hahaha. I was so confused that time, I choose aren't I, but my mother ended up getting angrier. And she forced me still. In the end I attended that event.

I won, so it doesn't matter.

Going back. I'm reading Why Fall in Love if You Can Attend Tsinghua University currently. I read Guide to Raising the Sick Villain before this. And I read many more before. At first I ignore it cause it a fictional novel. But now I can't help but mention it.

Not that I criticize, sorry but I can't help it. I'm curious. Thinking back on my school days, I could count on my two hands when I volunteered to study. I can't even stand reading academic book in 10 minutes. It's different from novels.

I manage to graduate because I rely on my strength in different aspects. But I really hate studying and memorizing. If I don't like the subject, it's bye bye. And it will turned into one digit score. I could only maintain average grade because of some other means. Not money okay, were.not rich. I'm talking about projects reports and such. I always perfected it.

But surely. It's not just about grades.

Right?

 

AFAIK, the Chinese Gaokao is all about rigorous drilling and intensive rote memorization- all for the sake of grades which can, apparently, make or break your future. Same for the class teachers, who I've heard are evaluated on the basis of their students' performance in said entrance exams. In fact, I'd argue it's not much different (in my limited knowledge) for other Asian countries, so... ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

That is something that I’ve noticed too with many Chinese school novels, I’m not really sure about how the culture is in China but it likely does have some level of influence on these novels which is then exaggerated to make easily hatable antagonists. Now that I think about it China is also heavily invested into their education which can Ben seen from how every year an extra Chinese uni is added into the top 100 and that their ranks are steadily rising. So perhaps grades are that important over there.

 

Its really not.

 

Well...money makes the world go round and a sensible student who does the bidding is also looked upon favourably. So, yeah, that's just the norm here.

 

Care to enlighten how not? I only hv very limited knowledge on the topic (mostly garnered from CNs).

 

I was actually agreeing with your last sentence. Its really not different across other Asian countries.

 

Haven't read either novels mentioned, though I'm tempted to read the former just because of its name.

Grades are essentially what we call a "necessary evil." They are an assessment that is more or less agreed upon by everyone (important/powerful enough), a value that estimates your proficiency in a certain topic or subject. The problem is, is that grades aren't accurate and cannot convey every vital aspect. A student can get full marks on a test, but it doesn't ensure that said student didn't cram last night, didn't cheat during the test, or would retain the information at a sufficient depth in the future.

To put into a real world example, practically every student in America thinks the ACT and the SAT are complete jokes. It's not a good assessment to "how well you do in college" since people prepare ahead of time, and how does a sheet of multiple choice really constitute everything? Some people do better at multiple choice while others do worse in it. An older version of the tests apparently tested on definitions of esoteric terms, which no one would ever use in a casual manner, or even a professional manner, unless they are that one prick that gets up everyone's ass via a cycle of using words no one ever hears of and consequently mocking them for their seemingly "weak" vocabulary. Everyone thinks it's just one of those profiting schemes from a sham of a "non-profit organization," but universities suck off CollegeBoard, so students have to too.

Now that we have established that grades are a terrible way to assess someone's academic ability, why do people use it?

Because humans lack the necessary power and resources to do anything in depth. You are definitely correct; life isn't just about grades. But without good grades or a scholarship or other certification to prove your ability, universities won't recognize your academic prowess. Without good grades or work experience, you won't get a job. No organization would ever in their right mind invest in extensive, complex assessments. For every applicant. No admissions officer is going to sneak into your room while you are studying to write a report on how good your work ethic is or how resourceful you are.

I cannot say for east asian countries for sure, since I wasn't a student there, but their lives revolve around grades. Especially that one huge entrance exam / ability test that all three of those countries take. The stress is immense to try to get into a prestigious university, and everyone who wants to get in will try to one up everyone else, because a spot taken is a spot you didn't get. If you scored mediocrely, you probably fucked up. If you failed, you've fucked up harder. Sure, you probably could take it the next year, but if you hang around with those that put maintaining face at number one priority, they will keep talking. And to be honest, this probably happens everywhere in Asia, from east to south, though not sure about the west.

 

Don't forget the cheating. Every college class I had with Chinese students basically had them with their phones out during exams. Plus they have no creativity in my experience. Very bad partners for group projects

 

Its more about money here, entrance test are only for formalities unless its one of those science based schools

 

We have SAT as well. But it was called NAT. Teachers were vigorously serious about this. But if I remember correctly, I passed this mainly by cheating. No offence. But I did this when practice exam. It's supper confusing because of those shading and those hundreds of items.

But I'm from Asia. In our country, since the educational system were rewritten, high authorities were now focused on multi intelligence.

Though, public school rarely focused on this because of over crowded students, private school advocate this points.

That's why, if a student is bad in acads, teachers will motivate there students in other subjects like sports or arts.


Before, grades really made students life different. But I didn't experienced this face to face. I just heard it, well from our neighbors. She beat her child cause she went down from top 2 to 3. She want her child to be the first.

I really can't understand this. Now when I was seeing this neighbor, I can see her child always wandering outside never returning to their home anymore.

 

In asian country, education is much more inflexible and disciplined compared to its western counterparts.

As you are asking specifically for Chinese education, their entire education system is the 3rd strictest after Korean and Japanese education. To the extent of repeating years on college entrance exams are actually quite normal, albeit still embarrasing.

It is so hard that only the top 1% is able to get the best education.

What makes the Chinese and Korean/Japanese education system different is essentialy what happened after you graduate.
Chinese work ethics emphasized the importance on experience/age, political correctness, Social connection, family background, and individual reputation.

Yep, except the basic, you wont use much of the knowledge you memorized unless you are planning to become a teacher, doctor, scientist, or anything similar. However, your grades and your life experiences will be recorded in your student file and will become a vital point in your career. A few blemishes on your grades and which college you graduated from could potentially stop you from enterring a specific career, thus why people emphasize the importance of 'face' and 'politically correctness' even more on China.

All of the factors above are a breeding ground of discrimination, because the distinct reward is quite hard to not notice. This creates an obvious gap in between students. Coupled with how intense the competition (because how few people able to get in a good college) is making people to be quite desperate and unforgiving in student's community.

 

Asian here, I'm from Philippines and what you're describing sums up pretty much our cultural viewpoint around education. The reason with this is because life opportunities here are lesser than most western countries. I'm assuming tho, that a college/high school dropout can still get a job or start a business, but here in Asia, all you'll probably end up with is a tricycle driver or a random retail vendor, a starving family and a nagging wife.

As for the issue revolving around cheating... we don't really care about those. Teachers care more about the students and they'll go out of their way to get to know them, therefore when a particularly lazy person suddenly aced a test, then there'll be suspicions. Basically, you'll have to cheat throughout your whole life to graduate or just study normally and top them.

 

When you have limited resources to serve a large target audience, you'll inevitably have to cut corners. It's like the iron triangle of healthcare: Quality, Cost, Access. Pick one, two at most. Pick all three and congratulations, you've fucked the system even harder and now everyone hates you.

Grades have seen, if even slightly, a decrease in importance because politicians in some countries finally got through their thick fucking skulls that maybe regurgitation of information is less important than application of information. I don't know what caused this paradigm shift in education focus, though my guess is people like Bill Gates since he dropped out of university and became one of the richest people in his time.

As for that anecdote, I'm not surprised it hurt their relationship. It's one thing if the child thinks the punishment is justified (which opens up a whole 'nother can of worms), and another if the child thinks that was undeserved and a complete overreaction. Humans are fear-avoidant creatures; it's rather traumatizing to believe you aren't even safe at home. It's like how some people love their time at school since it's time away from their family beating them, but in this case, it's as if the school that determines whether it's safe at home.

 

NAT is more of a personality test based on academics, My teachers treat it as that, they specifically said we have to answer the questions seriously even if we get them wrong. If I remember correctly there's a guide of courses you are suited with based on what score and what subjects you excelled in the exam, so if you cheated on that then you are basically shooting yourself in the foot.

 

Wow~

Seriously!

NAT isn't it National Achievement Test? If I remember correctly it was NCAI, that's more like to be a personality and career test.

That's were I found out that I'm.mkre compatible with science. Hehehe.

From Philippines too. So, bro I understand you. Hehehe.

 

Japan is not strict compared to Korea or China.

 

It doesn't matter if you are a dropout, 1st ranker or a bum, they'll suck you dry.

 

*hamster who was always proud of her SAT scores* ....

 

It is strict and you could only feel it after graduated. Japan has a very high standard in work ethics compared to Korea and China.
Even if you are hired relatively more easily in Japan, but it could end pretty quickly if you don't meet up the industry's standard.
It is the norm to be fired within a month or two of your first work in Japan even if you are working as hard as you could.
Your grades and your college would help you to stay afloat longer on your first job, as it reflects your potential and giving you more leeway for them to invest in you.

Japanese's education strictness does not lie in its written or formal system. It lies on their work ethics and societal pressure.
You are meant to be a working overtime, even if nobody ask you to. That's how strict it is.

Why do you think Japan has more hikkikomori and suicide rate compared to other Asian country? That's because Japan has the strictest societal norm compared to other country. If you do not follow the societal norm and standard, you will be isolated, peer pressured, and discriminated.