Discussion When you hear the word [Hero]...

Who or what comes to mind when you hear the word [Hero]? A fictional character? The people who put their lives on the line everyday? People who help others? Superman? What comes to mind?

 

Nausea. Brings up unpleasant associations of sanctimonious, righteous, goody-two-shoes who cannot see beyond their own sanitized worldview. Hypocrites.

That is not to say I do not acknowledge heroism, but the term itself has come to acquire a unflattering implication in my mind.

 

Basically idiots that take a risk. It is just that hero succeds and is praised while the other guy who did the same failed and became a laughing stock.

 

Donald Trump

 

When I see the word [Hero], I in turn think of the word [Hope]. It is the hero that carries hope in order for the world to pull through. But if we apply our understanding of the word [Hero]/[Protagonist] we gained from reading novels. We either see the murderous Chinese hypocritic cultivators. The antiheroes that usually consist in Korean novels. Or the overpowered wet dream self-inserts in JP. I mean among the three, self-inserts will exist. But I do not trust the novel hero.

Though among the three there are exceptional stories. The exceptions are the novels that we judge are the best. But in accordance with this, we realize the shortcomings of each category.

 

Yeah I dislike the whole [Hero] title & shtick. Self-righteous, dumb idealists blind to reality & hypocritical to boot when it suits them (without even realising they are being hypocritical).
Give me self-aware anti-heroes or even villainous MC's any day of the week.

 

People who take risks and get recognized. The “heroes” succeed, get recognized, and praised while those that helped saved people along with that person are ignored/counted as a side character just because they don’t take their part of the credit/someone else takes all the credit and people chooses to believe things without seeing the whole thing (kinda like some of those YouTube videos where people post videos about “helping others”.) The heroes themselves are often seen as someone who is a goody-two-shoe which I don’t really like since anyone can be a hero even if they are not what we picture them to be like.

So whenever I think of [Hero], I think of stereotypical or nausea.

 

That one scene from a Japanese comedy drama where this assassin licks his poisoned knife

 

Interesting...responses, but totally agreeable. Which is kinda sad since how it wasn't supposed to be that way.

 

True scum and worst hypocrites.

 

I think of my favourite villains that beat the hero in stories of reincarnation as villain/villainess

 

Hero is someone with a firm heart or in chinese term a firm Dao.

Some people call them stupid, look down on them and their views, call them scum and hypocrite, call them self-righteous, and many others.

But these words mean nothing to Hero, he have his Dao and that's all he needs. He can save people and be ignored or even insulted. But he will save them again and again. Even if people hate him and torture him, Hero will continue to love them.

 

I love heroes , i don't mean fakers but true heroes , they fight for people and believe it is worth it and achieve impossible through hard work and a strong will

 

Yet your hero can faithfully slaughter the masses of innocents. How much innocents paves his way, are those who disrespect him innocent? What about them doing the evil acts/deeds. Using a Human Cauldron, drain touch, or basically the robbing of an innocent's wellbeing. What about their greed. The point of the Dao is to only focus on it, do not put politics or other goals that conflict with the dao in your sight. In order for one to maintain their self within the dao they must keep their morals and ethics while working within them. The dao is the way to immortality and it is against nature, but one must be in tune with nature to even traverse it. The protagonist that is a cultivator is not the hero. A Hero is someone who would win against all odds having built up to it without bulshittery and would do so righteously. The hero is human good idealized.

 

I'll never think of any character as a Hero who can simply win against anything in their way, clear any problem.

Best modern works are about how the word lost its meaning because no person in the setting could be called a hero. Like One Punch Man. Saitama can win against anyone in front of him. Mumen Rider is the one who truly risks himself everytime he is out there. But neither is a hero.

Saitama truly seeks a challenge and a worthy opponent who won't die like a bitch to one punch. He is a blood knight who happens to do good deeds out of a hobby.

Mumen Rider is completely ineffective. Kinda like Rocky Balboa in most Rocky movies, he talks with a mix of humble and confident in his stance, but all he does is take hits and get carted off to treatment at the end of every fight while someone else gets the threat solved.

So neither is a hero. Saitama onscreen doesn't put anything on the line (his only moment I can recall is against Lobster guy hack when Saitama had hair and didn't know rushing in would still end with him alive), much less his life, while Mumen Rider just never overcame any threat onscreen. At all.

King had a few heroic moments. His "King engine" legit killed an enemy who could potentially have easily killed King and all other civilians around if he just didn't die from fear knowing King was his foe.

In the end, a hero loses after a disaster has passed and the time comes to live or die from the consequences. PTSD, purely physical complications,... and little is done for them, like for the many heroes of 9/11 or soldiers after a war for protecting their people and homeland.

The definition of the word has simply changed too much with common preception and usage of the word through the ages. It used to be simply someone who pulled off feats impossible for ordinary men. In my country, a legend's definition of a hero is literally a dragonblooded man with strength akin to an ox. Whatever their flaws or follies, that's the criteria in old stories. The strength was the important bit as one legend had a lad gain his strength due to the blessing of a fairy ( supernatural women of great beauty only seen on rare occasions).

Greeks had it be a man of great deeds who often had divine blood or due to his fame would even be king and get his lineage entangled with some god through a wife, sons or daughters,...

To the chinese, it seems to be any man far above his peers, be it in martial prowess or an intellectual pursuit. Like "heroes" of 3 Kingdoms who actually just killed people, and to a modern person would be merely mass murderers.

Who or what is a hero for me? On the fictional side, Heroes of Might and Magic 5 had Godric. The old knight did his best at fighting demons, guiding a queen to be the best she can be for the Griffin Empire, raising a daughter as valiant and zealous as himself in pursuit of the wicked and protecting the innocent and killed a Necromancer who was poised to truly take over the Empire by subverting the grieving Queen and bringing her husband backa s a Vampire and her being a puppet.

He wasn't always successful or well directed at fighting these threats. He didn't know the artefact ( Heart of the Griffin) doesn't kill demons, just return them to their hellish spawning grounds, he listened to his queen when she let the Necromancer in the leading circle to bring back her husband out of loyalty after she rebuffed Godric's protests, age left him frailer than his young days of glory and he died from wounds in prison ( there was a demon disguised as the queen screwing over the empire, expansion of the game) despite his daughter finally reaching him after a campaign.

On the real life side, it would be the workers and great minds who elevated human culture and society to such heights( materially as well as in intangible heritage like the sciences and arts) with their work and lives spent. Too many to count really.

 

The words "Idolization", " Manipulation ", and Perspective comes to mind.

When someone is labelled as a "hero", there 's a tendency that the person will be put in a different group than "normal humans". This led some people to view the said person as a "paragon of virtue" or some sort. It's putting someone on a pedestal, that might make them seems to be more, or less, than a normal human. Sometimes, people expected that a hero will only do good for the rest of their life, and any shows of human vulnerability (like selfishness, greed, etc) might be seen as a betrayal of the people's beliefs.


The label 'hero' is also a play of perspective, that also subtly serve as a tool of manipulation. A soldier might be lauded as "patriot" and a "hero" by their country to motivate them in a war, but labeled as a "killer" and "villain" by the people whose relation have been killed by the said soldier. Factory workers might be labelled as a "hero" by the country and capital holders, all to make them have a "sense of pride", unity and belonging in their work, and thus make them to be more productive and bring loads of money...to the capital holders.

So, what's a hero? A title created by an interest group, to be given by someone who promotes the said group's interest with such a fervour, that they stand out from the rest group member. It's also a tool to motivate someone to do things and adhere to rules that most wouldn't want to uphold.

 

Too much AMQ has made the first thing that pops into my mind when I hear "hero"... "One Punch Man"

The opening shouts "hero" really loudly and I can't unhear it lol

 

I'm a bit on the fence with this. It definitely is a given that Mumen Rider won't get anything done when faced against the monstrosities in the OPM world.

Yet I disagree that Mumen Rider had not overcome any threat at all. On the contrary, I'd say he overcame quite a lot.

Mumen Rider is the epitome of the weak non-heroes, an embodiment of the average man. He looks average, and he doesn't have any particularly outstanding abilities. He could probably do a couple cool party tricks on his bicycle, but he lacks any practical fighting power. Maybe throw in a punch or two, maybe an additional kick, but that's it.
Yet, I find him to be a hero. Because he continues to fight against the heartless and cruel, knowing very well how little he is able to do. In the face of insurmountable evil, he has the courage to not flee in terror but continue to face his fears. He is the person every average man and woman aspires to be: someone who can face their fears head-on and someone who can so readily sacrifice themselves. Because how many people can actually admit they are capable of doing this. How many people are willing to put their own lives at risk time and time again, if only just to by mere seconds more time for others to run. I've seen so many men and so many women, conventionally successful, attractive, athletically fit, and yet, they refuse to take responsibility for a mistake, to ignore that they were wrong, and to shrug off the fact that they've hurt others because of it.
Heroes do not have to accomplish great feats that shake the world. You don't have to conquer vast lands to be a hero. You don't have to cure cancer to be a hero. How many adventurers in isekai novels openly dismiss low-ranked quests because they found it to be beneath them. After they've subjugated that terrible dragon, can you really call those kinds of people true heroes?
To help those in need, a friendly neighbor helping an elderly person cross a street, a firefighter rescuing two unconscious children from a collapsing, burning building, the farmer who cheers up a customer who had a bad day by sneaking in a couple extra oranges. Objects of fear and acts of heroism can be found in all magnitudes and in all varieties. Evil can be found from life-threatening situations to a lack of responsibility, they can be physical harm now or mental trauma in the future. The like can be said about heroes too.

So back to Mumen Rider. It's true that without the other members of the Hero Association, humanity would have been dead a hundred times over. But I'd still say he is a hero. And even if he isn't, he possesses that noble heart to face his fears, not out of fearlessness or from the comfort of confidence in his own outstanding abilities and strength, but out of great courage and iron will, and a willingness to sacrifice himself for the sake of others. He is the model person, the heroic "ideal" that the common man and woman aspire to be. He may not be the hero to slay evils, but he is the hero that inspires one to stand up for oneself and to accept responsibility for the mistakes we've ran away from. A hope to change for the better, and that, in an of itself, should be an outstanding strength more than enough worthy of admiration.

 

I disagree completely on Mumen Rider being a hero. He is a good example for being more helpful and nothing else.

 

Believe it or not, I think about Italian peasants.

Spoiler: One morning I awakened Oh Goodbye beautiful, Goodbye beautiful, Goodbye beautiful! Bye! Bye! One morning I awakened And I found the invader

Oh partisan carry me away
Oh Goodbye beautiful, Goodbye beautiful, Goodbye beautiful! Bye! Bye!
Oh partisan carry me away
Because I feel death approaching

And if I die as a partisan
(And if I die on the mountain)
Oh Goodbye beautiful, Goodbye beautiful, Goodbye beautiful! Bye! Bye!
And if I die as a partisan
(And if I die on the mountain)
Then you must bury me

Bury me up in the mountain
(And you have to bury me)
Oh Goodbye beautiful, Goodbye beautiful, Goodbye beautiful! Bye! Bye!
Bury me up in the mountain
(And you have to bury me)
Under the shade of a beautiful flower

And the people who shall pass
(And all those who shall pass)
Oh Goodbye beautiful, Goodbye beautiful, Goodbye beautiful! Bye! Bye!
And the people who shall pass
(And all those who shall pass)
Will tell me: "what a beautiful flower"
(And they will say: "what a beautiful flower")

This is the flower of the partisan

(And this is the flower of the partisan)
Oh Goodbye beautiful, Goodbye beautiful, Goodbye beautiful! Bye! Bye!
This is the flower of the partisan

(And this is the flower of the partisan)
Who died for freedom