Weird grammar question~

Discussion in 'General Chat' started by Gandire Alea, Jun 15, 2021.

?

Which is better

  1. A

    2 vote(s)
    6.7%
  2. B

    20 vote(s)
    66.7%
  3. *nom skullie"

    8 vote(s)
    26.7%
  1. Gandire Alea

    Gandire Alea [Wicked Awesome Translator]

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2017
    Messages:
    4,014
    Likes Received:
    70,797
    Reading List:
    Link
    A. "I have played the piano since last year."

    B. "I have been playing the piano since last year."

    Which would you say is better and why??
     
  2. Ruyue

    Ruyue Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2018
    Messages:
    1,020
    Likes Received:
    7,175
    Reading List:
    Link
  3. Bad Storm

    Bad Storm no thought, head empty

    Joined:
    Jun 8, 2017
    Messages:
    4,836
    Likes Received:
    52,807
    Reading List:
    Link
    since it's not clear whether the action is continuing in the present, i think A is better.

    edit 1: oh wait, joke. time was mentioned xD
     
  4. canaria23

    canaria23 『  』

    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2015
    Messages:
    9,488
    Likes Received:
    10,955
    Reading List:
    Link
    The first is wrong in the first place, so the second one wins by default.
    The 1st one be like this
    I have "not" played the piano since last year.
    Since the word played means the action stopped.
     
    Lissi, KazeYuki, Sproutling and 4 others like this.
  5. Bad Storm

    Bad Storm no thought, head empty

    Joined:
    Jun 8, 2017
    Messages:
    4,836
    Likes Received:
    52,807
    Reading List:
    Link
    :blobastonished::hmm:
     
    Deleted member 348269 likes this.
  6. Gandire Alea

    Gandire Alea [Wicked Awesome Translator]

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2017
    Messages:
    4,014
    Likes Received:
    70,797
    Reading List:
    Link
    The grammar wars have started
     
  7. Bad Storm

    Bad Storm no thought, head empty

    Joined:
    Jun 8, 2017
    Messages:
    4,836
    Likes Received:
    52,807
    Reading List:
    Link
    i think I'm on the wrong side though
     
  8. Gandire Alea

    Gandire Alea [Wicked Awesome Translator]

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2017
    Messages:
    4,014
    Likes Received:
    70,797
    Reading List:
    Link
    Fufufu~
    It's a war everyone can regardless of what side they are on.
     
  9. AliceShiki

    AliceShiki 『Ms. Tree』『Magical Girl of Love and Justice』

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2016
    Messages:
    24,647
    Likes Received:
    98,366
    Reading List:
    Link
    B seems to make more sense for me~
     
    idlereader likes this.
  10. MangoGuy

    MangoGuy Rambling Mango

    Joined:
    Apr 15, 2016
    Messages:
    7,625
    Likes Received:
    8,697
    Reading List:
    Link
    Sentence B is gramatically apt, and also makes better sense.
     
    idlereader likes this.
  11. Ddraig

    Ddraig Frostfire Dragon|Retired lurker|FFF|Loved by RNG

    Joined:
    Apr 6, 2016
    Messages:
    7,853
    Likes Received:
    22,455
    Reading List:
    Link
    B makes more sense to me
     
  12. Havisu

    Havisu Night Lurker

    Joined:
    Nov 13, 2015
    Messages:
    754
    Likes Received:
    767
    Reading List:
    Link
    I don't particularly mind grammar mistakes etc, because I usually just go with the best sounding, or the one that makes sense.

    But from what I understand, the first sentence is in the form of past participle tense, which make use of "have" and "played", while the second sentence use present perfect continuous tense, which make use of "been" + "ing (playing)" + "since".

    In a sense, B makes more sense, and make it clear that the piano is still being played even now. However, A is not working wrong either.

    What makes all of us instinctively think B is the correct one while A is not, is that from the sentence structure of A, it is as if the piano is being played since last year, and still being played even now, and without any rest or break, continuing even now as we speak. In other word, the use of verb (action) and that "since" in the first sentence is making the whole sentence looks weird.

    It doesn't make sense that someone is playing the piano the whole time, without stopping at all.

    Normally, the first sentence is used with not a verb, but an adjective.

    For example:
    - I have known about that piano since last year.

    This makes sense because it indicates that I have known and never forgot (unless stated later on) about the piano since last year. I never stopped knowing about the piano.

    Now try to make the second sentence using this "known" adjective.

    - I have been knowing about the piano since last year..

    Sound so wrong right?

    But if we used noun instead of adjective here

    - the piano have been in my knowledge since last year.

    Knowledge is the noun here. So it now it makes sense.

    Now let's switch our attention to the second sentence.

    From sentence B, we can imply that the piano have been played by the narrator since last year, but its not being constantly played all the time either. The sentence make it sound like its a continuous act of playing the piano, but with breaks and rest. So it makes more sense. Nothing to dispute about the second sentence here.

    That's why, IMO, both are grammatically correct, but since we're using the verb here, the second sentence is better.

    The first sentence is not wrong, but illogical.

    Again, this is all from my understanding.
     
    babybb and Munimuyi like this.
  13. asriu

    asriu fu~ fu~ fu~

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2016
    Messages:
    18,546
    Likes Received:
    18,145
    Reading List:
    Link
    as @Ruyue mention that perfect sentence type, so both is correct depend on the intention of the speaker~

    A. play piano but dunno will play piano again or not
    B. still play piano

    hey english have past. present. future, perfect and combination ya know~ isn't that basic stuff?
     
    Havisu likes this.
  14. Sproutling

    Sproutling We are the Sproutlings

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2015
    Messages:
    989
    Likes Received:
    1,015
    Reading List:
    Link
    And most people vote B, so yeah B is better.
     
  15. Gandire Alea

    Gandire Alea [Wicked Awesome Translator]

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2017
    Messages:
    4,014
    Likes Received:
    70,797
    Reading List:
    Link
    amazing, noming skullie isn't winning here
     
  16. Kadmos1

    Kadmos1 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2017
    Messages:
    2,982
    Likes Received:
    1,538
    Reading List:
    Link
    Things like this are a reason why writers might go through many drafts before the finalized product.
     
  17. God slayer

    God slayer Retired God Slayer

    Joined:
    Dec 2, 2020
    Messages:
    1,294
    Likes Received:
    3,009
    Reading List:
    Link
    Latter:blobpeek::blobpeek::blobpeek: it just feels right to me.....
     
  18. Zissel

    Zissel Blue Blue Gold❣❣

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2021
    Messages:
    1,047
    Likes Received:
    7,111
    Reading List:
    Link
    Obviously the second option. The first one's wrong. When you're using since as a time indicator, the tense used should always be perfect continuous.
    Edit: I was actually wrong about always using since for perfect continuous. Here are the possible correct answers-
    • Option B. Correct for the aforementioned reason.
    • "I have not played the piano since last year" In this case, though since is as a time indicator, when we use not in the sentence it indicates something that has happened last year and is still true.
    • "I have played the piano" The sentence has been cut off from the word since and as such doesn't indicate a certain time and the meaning changes to playing the piano before and it being true still.
     
    Last edited: Jun 16, 2021
    asriu likes this.
  19. asriu

    asriu fu~ fu~ fu~

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2016
    Messages:
    18,546
    Likes Received:
    18,145
    Reading List:
    Link
    fumu this cat forget about about that should use since or from for perfect continue~
     
    Zissel likes this.