Discussion Should gas/electric/water be free?

Thoughts on if this was feasible.

 

Yeah sure it could be free, well technically we'd still be paying with taxes, but individually we'd all be paying a lot less.

 

I'm quite ignorant about these things so not sure how much my opinion would be worth, however there are at least to problems I could think of that would not make it seem very feasible, those being: excessive usage and higher taxes.
With no thought about bills and money to act as constrains people would obviously use more, which could bring a higher strain on both the environment (if you believe in that) as well as a companies due to high supply demand.
The thing with taxes is self-explanatory, it needs to be paid for in one way or the other and if not individually, then by taxes; which would put more pressure on the poorer people I would assume.

 

I guess one way to combat this would be to tax the rich [more] but that sounds more like a fantasy than utilities becoming free.

 

Well what if you get a certain amount of water/gas/electricity for free (taxed), but once you exceed that limit you have to pay for it yourself, i.e our current system.

 

Sex should be free and used to convert friction to a power source. I could fap enough energy for the whole block.

 

Gas, electric and water have infrastructure that are needed to happen. Pipes burst, power lines get cut by weather and there always wear and tear. Even if you had an enclosed self sustaining system or even reusable system. It would still needed maintenance at the very least. With a minimalist lifestyle. You still need things.
It is feasible to have automatic systems that replace parts. So you maybe able to cut some cost with labor. You will still need to pay someone to oversee everything. You may also be able to automate of 3D printing parts. But the initial cost astronomical. As to finding funding somewhere else. That doesn’t eliminate the cost. It just burdens another department/ system or person. So your not really getting it free. I just do not see this being reality

Seconded

 

not feasible. Public goods from the government will always be funded by tax. If it is privatized, obviously it must be paid by the people who utilize the service. So it's not really free.

Well... for electricity, you can maybe have paid initial cost of solar panel and battery, and enjoy electricity until they broke. You can also live near streams from the mountain and take water directly from there. For gas, depend on the country's stance on mining, I think. So, between convenience and freedom, which one do you choose?

 

probably that. Otherwise people would abuse the system and drain what should be communal resources for no good reason. Just make sure people's needs are covered.

 

It is like basic idea of communism. Even if it is free, supposing an utopia with free materials, equipment etc, somebody needs to use their time to keep it running. And in turn, they need to be compensated for this, and is a way it should also be "free access" to the other resources, services etc. Then, it becomes basically a "free economy" with people working for free while getting free benefits. Sounds nice, until you include slackers, neets, criminals etc who bring or even negative weight on the equality balance. And then comes human psychology, with "why would a part-timer cleaner and a surgeon working 18-hour microsurgeries get the same treatment?", before the society collapses.

 

Probably not. My flat comes with fixed gas and water prices and that makes my dad so wasteful. I really hate seeing that.

 

Sure why not. Except, consider the following...

If you exercised vigorously on a bike, you'd probably max out at generating 100W of power. Computers playing high end games suck up 4 - 7 times that much power. So you'd either need to throw out your games or you'd need to hire 7 people to bike in the background so you can play your AAA game. Pay them minimum wage...which is like $15 an hour now.

Gas? A cow farting will give you enough gas for a couple seconds of heat unless you perfect the capturing process. You'll need to own several cows to last the winter, and they're not going to fart unless you feed them. Grass doesn't grow during the winter. In all, you're looking at paying like $20k just to be self sufficient for a winter. At least you get meat on the side I suppose.

Water? Well, it's free to collect rain. Then you use it...and it gets converted by your body. After that, it's undrinkable. This is where the real cost of water comes from. You need to convert it back to a drinkable form and you need to get rid of the byproducts. Whether it takes energy to distill, or high technology to scrub, you'll get water back and some nasty byproduct that you need to move elsewhere. Now, I assume you're not just using the water for drinking but to farm and shower too. Same story, except now you have to clean several times more water and that's a significant enough quantity that you can't just set up the cleaning equipment in your garage anymore.

Unfortunately the prices that you're getting is basically bulk pricing as it's more efficient to get all of these by handling it from a massive standpoint rather than a personal standpoint. Unfortunately, that costs a hefty amount to set up and operate and no one is generous enough to fork that kind of money just to have their investment get leeched.

On a more serious note, a solar + battery installation will run you like $30k. It'll take 12 years to pay off assuming nothing breaks and your electric bill is $200 a month. If your electric bill is higher than that, you'll need a bigger system to stay off the grid...like say $50k to $70k for a $300/mo bill

If you're not setting up an oil well, then gas is going to require a solid waste farm. For a consistent output, I'd say you'd need at least an acre of space, it's extremely dangerous if there's an open flame nearby, plus you're not going to seal it perfectly so it's going to stink of holy hell when the wind turns your direction.

Water also needs a lot of space. Plus the chemicals that they use to sterilize the water can get pricey unless you buy it at scale.

 

Nothing is free and less if it comes from a third party, in this case the government.

So short answer is not possible.

ppl should be careful when something says "free"

 

Scarcity is the very basis of human economy. There is limited fresh water, limited gas, and electricity requires infrastructure to generate. Infrastructure requires materials. Materials are finite.

Thus, scarcity comes into play. And in that play you know you can't give away finite, precious resources for free. So... something with equivalent perceived value needs to be exchanged. In this case it would be money being exchanged.

So no. Not feasible at all

 

Water and power are cheap enough in the US. Property is expensive and taxes right now are ridiculous. If you make things "free" you make it government owned. You are basically giving them power over you or to tax you to kingdom come.

 

People have already stated this but nothing is truly free. The infrastructure and resources needed to produce and transport electricity, water, and gas cost money to maintain and operate. That money would just come from taxes instead of being a direct cost on the consumer.

There are a number of issues with this model. The most striking to me is that there is no longer an incentive to reduce consumption of these limited resources. Since any excessive use by an individual would be distributed across everyone’s taxes there would be little to no reason to cut back on electricity or gas usage. This would incentivize less efficient cars and devices as well as lead to an acceleration in climate change.

So in short, no it is not feasible and would likely do more harm than good.

 

Agreed with @Iruma666 @Kaminomikan @Shiki
It's not possible to implement such targeted usage quotas across all spectrums of society and all organizations (think hospitals, factories, etc).
Any amount of freebie quota means everyone will just shift their behavior to abuse that quote. i.e. if I only have 1 thousand gallon/mth/person, even if I normally only use 0.5, I'll deliberately move up to 1 thousand.

 

If something is required to survive in today's society, then its a human right, and should be free yes. Water, gas and electric are essential to living within society.

 

People are wasteful if it is free
Should be inexpensive but not free

 

Free infrastructure is basically the socialist version of universal basic income - something that won't likely happen until the most advanced economy has gone full automation for the biggest part of its workforce. Also, it will be very hard to make water free since the volume of fresh water seems to be dwindling as the years go by, as opposed of gas and electricity which source can be substituted or delivered more efficiently with the more advanced research efforts poured into them.