Spoiler This Marriage Is Bound To Fail, Anyway / 이 결혼은 어차피 망하게 되어있다 / This marriage is bound to sink

Discussion in 'Spoilers' started by seoktonin, May 8, 2021.

  1. PattyCakes

    PattyCakes Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2021
    Messages:
    821
    Likes Received:
    3,271
    Reading List:
    Link
    Everyone was given free will. Oscar had his chances too. Theres no unfair between any character cuz they all got their chances.
     
  2. NohrNeir

    NohrNeir rereading frenzy

    Joined:
    Apr 28, 2020
    Messages:
    1,433
    Likes Received:
    29,939
    Reading List:
    Link
    I'm agnostic so I'm not sure as well, but I think the incorporation of Catholicism into the plot is very well intertwined that I can't complain. I've looked into Catholicism with a researcher's POV when delving into the novel. I'll say I'm still not religious but it's a very interesting aspect. Even if people don't believe in Christianity, I think there are many other takes that can be obtained from the novel between how characters dealt with moving on, depression, rape, life and death, interactions with each other, etc.

    And as others have note free will is given to all. I'm not even sure if there's actually fate in our world but in their world it exists. Yet even with fate, I believe even in their world, each character have free will on how they choose to live with their fate. A good example is Olga. I'm sure Olga had followed fate throughout, same as the emperor and empress, but are they "good" people? They seem far from it. Olga goes through character development in the side story but I don't see much of that for the emperor, so people can still be "bad" people even if they live following their fate and when their time comes for day of judgment according to the Christian scriptures, then they will really get their punishment. But with all the chances given, Oscar could've lived as a better person. He didn't even have to be a "good" person. There's also too much gray area in some people to put them into good and bad.

    It is an important aspect in the manhwa. If it connects well with the story I see no reason why it should be taken out, even if some people are weary of religion in fiction.
     
  3. Celebrianna

    Celebrianna ❤️‍Solo Leveling❣️

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2020
    Messages:
    1,886
    Likes Received:
    16,960
    Reading List:
    Link
    So I want to show you Ille Tasya and all the precious and beautiful things in the world for the rest of my life. While you’re happily looking around the world, I will be living my entire life looking at you like that.
    -Translated by @NohrNeir
    This man is so darn romantic. I just love how exciting he makes life for Ines and I especially love that he wants to show her the world and all the beautiful things in the world. And, it’s truly doable because, according to @NohrNeir , he built her a ship, La Eternidad. They can certainly use it to traverse far and wide. When I think about all the tragedies she endured, I truly appreciate the fulfilling life she lives now. I remember @NohrNeir said that before they left the island to return to Mendoza, she thanked Carcel for showing her so many beautiful and happy things. Sometimes it’s hard to believe that this is the same Ines who was prepared to live her life quietly waiting for death. There is so much that she would have missed out on. Thank goodness that Carcel has a personality of utmost patience and he instinctively loves her just like breathing so she didn’t waste her precious last chance by following her original plan. Instead, she was unwittingly disarmed each day by getting caught up in Carcel’s flow and before she knew it, he had won her over with his sincerity and deeply affectionate care.
     
  4. NohrNeir

    NohrNeir rereading frenzy

    Joined:
    Apr 28, 2020
    Messages:
    1,433
    Likes Received:
    29,939
    Reading List:
    Link
    I do believe only Carcel can do that for her. In their 1st lifetime he always believed himself to be her prison because he didn't think she wanted to marry anyone but was forced to marry him due to their status and his love for her. Carcel's wish had always been to set her free. Regardless, she can only say she's free within his clutches because he's always the one who ends up lifting her from pains. Her 1st life was not without perils and grief, but like every other lifetime, he kept at his patience and eventually even after all her phases of depressions, after the death of many children, she did manage to live a content life towards her final years. Her last thought during that timeline was coincidentally the first time he brought her somewhere right after they married, the lake in Esposa.

    Her character development is what drives the story. Carcel will remain steadfast as he had always in all lifetimes. Even if it took her many lifetimes to get to where she is, what matters is that she will never make light of their struggles and come to appreciate the present more because of their past together. Tahaka once mentioned to her that it seems their marriage is so easy, only Ines and Carcel can say it wasn't easy. Ines' original plan wouldn't have made her happy because she was just living to die. That's not a fulfilling life if you're just living just to wait for death to come. At least now, she's living because she wants to live for a long time and when death comes, she will welcome it because she would have already lived a life she found fulfilling.

    Ines is far from perfect but she came to acknowledge she's perfect for Carcel just as Carcel is perfect for her. They're just like one being.
     
    Last edited: Sep 18, 2022
  5. PattyCakes

    PattyCakes Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2021
    Messages:
    821
    Likes Received:
    3,271
    Reading List:
    Link
    your crush likes this.
  6. Tishes

    Tishes Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2021
    Messages:
    71
    Likes Received:
    85
    Reading List:
    Link
    Recs for k novels similar to this one please:
    (Historical, good chemistry between leads...)
     
  7. PattyCakes

    PattyCakes Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2021
    Messages:
    821
    Likes Received:
    3,271
    Reading List:
    Link
    She Was Sent by God
    I Quit Being the Male Lead's Rival
    The Tragedy of the Villainess
    Under the Oak Tree
    Lucia
    Predatory Marriage

    Don't think any are like this knovel but I like the chemistry between them
     
  8. Tishes

    Tishes Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2021
    Messages:
    71
    Likes Received:
    85
    Reading List:
    Link
    Thank you:blobsmilehappyeyes:
     
    PattyCakes likes this.
  9. starishaa

    starishaa Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2022
    Messages:
    117
    Likes Received:
    444
    Reading List:
    Link
    Thank you so much for the explanation and spoilers as it clears a lot of misunderstanding and misconceptions. I saw a lot of people solely blaming Ines’s family for the death of Emiliano and how the couple broke apart. However, even if I didn’t read spoilers much in depth, I can feel that Ines has already known of it ahead and accept the reality, especially the death of Emiliano. I’m glad that my assumption when reading Manhwa is kinda right, she committed suicide in her 3rd TL because of the death of her child, not specifically toward Emiliano.

    I don’t think she loved Emiliano (like wholehearted), it’s just that her life with him is happier compared to with Oscar, plus she got to have happy moments with her child (from what I remember she experienced miscarriage a lot in 2nd TL so spending more time with her child would be the most memorable to her). And Ines is still traumatized by her 2nd TL and she seduced Emiliano just to escape from the same fate, so I don’t think she trust the process of “love” that much (not like people expected from the ship of Ines and Emiliano).

    *it’s just my opinions, don’t get any wrong idea, because I saw people saying stuff like “Carcel doesn’t deserve Ines, Emiliano should be the one”; and I seem to disagree.

    Thank you! Gonna do a reply, so that I can read these letters again. I keep on wishing to have a Carcel in my life.
     
    Last edited: Sep 18, 2022
  10. NohrNeir

    NohrNeir rereading frenzy

    Joined:
    Apr 28, 2020
    Messages:
    1,433
    Likes Received:
    29,939
    Reading List:
    Link
    You're not so wrong. Most manhwa readers just have wrong assumptions about all the characters even the one they so claimed to root for because the Ines they're rooting for is nowhere near the character she really is. She's a character with flaws and gray morals. She's the character that will learn and regret and undergo everything all these readers expect Carcel to go through so it does make one question just how "trash" Carcel really is?

    As for Ines' love for Emiliano. She claimed it started with love but it really didn't. She literally just fell for his pretty face at first sight and decided to seduce him so it does go to question just how shallow she can be. As for growing to love him later on, it is mostly in comparison with Oscar. It was always in comparison with Oscar that she makes when comparing her love to Emiliano so it was obvious she would think she loved Emiliano a lot when she had been comparing it to someone like Oscar the whole time.

    This is drastically different with her love with Carcel. Ines compared Carcel mostly to her brother because Ines had experienced care and love before with her relationship with Luciano. Luciano, being the one she loved more than Emiliano. When she had nightmares, he stroked her to sleep. When she was sick, he took care of her. When she talked about hunting, both Carcel and Luciano taught her how to hunt before. Ines can feel Carcel's care and love because Luciano had done those things for her when she was young in past lives. But Ines also knew he was different. She also comes to realize her love for Carcel is different when she was given memories of Viviana's funeral during her first life. From that scene, she came to understand she had loved Carcel all along because the Ines from 1st life knew she loved Carcel and her current feelings matched that of the Ines from 1st lifetime. Here, she's not comparing her love with Carcel with any of her past husbands. She knows love because she had experienced love before. It was a "wholehearted" love as you had mentioned she didn't have with Emiliano.

    I had also shared letters from 2 other volumes. :blobsmilehappyeyes:
     
    Last edited: Sep 18, 2022
  11. Celebrianna

    Celebrianna ❤️‍Solo Leveling❣️

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2020
    Messages:
    1,886
    Likes Received:
    16,960
    Reading List:
    Link
    Excellent post as always. I would like to provide examples:
    1. There is a part in the novel where Ines said she thought she loved Oscar earlier in their relationship when they were each other’s firsts but after meeting Emiliano, she realizes that was never love.
    2. She admits that in her previous life with the painter, she worshipped “Love” like a sacred image. In Catholicism, they use sacred images/objects as worship, like pictures of Virgin Mary and crucifixes. It also supports why she speaks of their time as “perfect love” that seems unrealistic. She always describes Emiliano as good, perfect, beautiful and other idealized words as though he’s a human that doesn’t poop and doesn’t have shortcomings. She also describes him as someone so nice that he doesn’t suit her.
    3. When Oscar hung those paintings to force Ines to reveal that she has her memories, the conversation he and Ines had on the balcony mostly involved him, her and the painter. They always appear together because Oscar is the catalyst for Ines hooking up with the painter. Ines even admits that when she died in the second and third timelines, she would have been known as Oscar’s crown princess and the other, Oscar’s fiancée who betrayed him. It’s only in the fourth timeline that her name is never associated with Oscar even when he and his bitch wife causes a scandal of attempting to sexually assault her. The entire Ortega knows Ines as the war hero, Carcel Escalante’s wife, Ines Escalante.
    4. With Carcel, the very first time he held her after she suffered a seizure, she said it’s the safest she’s felt over her lifetimes except in another timeline when Luciano made her feel safe.
    5. When she thought of reviving those days of innocence, before Oscar ruined her life in prior timelines, it’s young Luciano and Carcel that are associated with those days of innocence. They hunted together and Carcel refreshed her shooting skills in this current timeline but Luciano was the one who initially taught her in another timeline.
    6. When Oscar revealed information to her about the second timeline, it’s Luciano and Carcel who collaborated to avenge her death on Oscar. She was very moved when she learned this truth. She later apologizes to Luciano three times because she kept him at a distance and she regrets it. As to Carcel, who was still away at war, she was upset hearing Oscar mock him about the the way he wielded him in the second timeline when Carcel chose to protect her from Oscar’s threat of sexually assaulting her.
    So, it’s always Oscar/Emiliano when it relates to her past and tragedies and always Carcel/Luciano when it relates to her safety and protection.
    @PattyCakes added:
    1. The wedding flashback with Emiliano was also compared to Oscar's wedding
    2. She also compare how Oscar's status don't overlook his disgusting things like how Emiliano's devoted love and face don't overlook his bad status and poverty
     
    Last edited: Sep 18, 2022
  12. PattyCakes

    PattyCakes Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2021
    Messages:
    821
    Likes Received:
    3,271
    Reading List:
    Link
    The wedding flashback with Emiliano was also compared to Oscar's wedding

    She also compare how Oscar's status don't overlook his disgusting things like how Emiliano's devoted love and face don't overlook his bad status and poverty
     
  13. solaria_

    solaria_ Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 2022
    Messages:
    201
    Likes Received:
    1,170
    Reading List:
    Link
    Chapter 17 was posted today on Bato and I never realized the silence can be so loud. The silence of the haters that is :blobjoy: Most of them were quiet but I could still sense some hostility in the air. But what are they gonna do now? At this point just drop and move on or bear with the actual story.

    The best part is that the support toward Carcel and Ines has started to increase. Can't wait for more and more people to join the OTP club :blob_pout:
     
  14. Celebrianna

    Celebrianna ❤️‍Solo Leveling❣️

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2020
    Messages:
    1,886
    Likes Received:
    16,960
    Reading List:
    Link
    :LOL: They just need to move on and stop misinterpreting the characters. The fact is, Ines is already married. They can wish divorce all they want, it won’t change the fact that she is not the type of person to cheat and she won’t be divorcing Carcel. Plus, if they truly got their wish, their god will just end up dead again because as we all know, Oscar knows where he is and what he’s doing.
     
  15. NohrNeir

    NohrNeir rereading frenzy

    Joined:
    Apr 28, 2020
    Messages:
    1,433
    Likes Received:
    29,939
    Reading List:
    Link
    Whenever she is with Carcel is when she really can be away and not connected to Oscar at all. That allows her to feel safe. Both in 1st and 4th lifetime, she didn't interact much with Oscar. Carcel had always been a good shield for her against him, just as she felt shielded from her mother with Luciano. But Carcel takes it further, because by marrying Carcel, she was also able to escape from being around her mother.

    I think even with devoted love, it's how each portrayed and acted on love that matters with a person. Emiliano was said to have devoted love but she never reminisce about how Emiliano treated her with love and care. Instead she mentioned he treated her like a princess of a poverty nation. It does hint to the dynamic between them especially when he still called her by 'Lady'. With Carcel, when she compared his care and love to Luciano, it felt more like a partner and of equals. And as always she never compared Carcel to Emiliano or Oscar. Her love and feelings for him are standalone. The manhwa readers keep comparing Carcel and Emiliano but to Ines, they cannot be compared because Emiliano is compared with Oscar, while Carcel is a separate person who becomes someone of great importance to her. Carcel was never a person she hated, so her feelings and understanding of him just naturally grows when she learns more about him. Her misconceptions of him just makes her feel regret and guilt for ever misunderstanding him. With this, it was the same with her brother.

    They will probably get quieter as the plot goes along because everything after their marriage is just humor, fluff and cute misunderstandings between the two during their newlywed phase. Even if the flashback from Emiliano shows up again, by then it'll be Carcel's development into realizing his feelings because Ines got a seizure. After that she doesn't care Emiliano again and volume 3 is towards the development of her feelings as she starts to get jealous of other women with Carcel and getting closer to him.
     
  16. PattyCakes

    PattyCakes Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2021
    Messages:
    821
    Likes Received:
    3,271
    Reading List:
    Link
    I saw too! :ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO: New ppl commenting and just wanting snu while most the haters were keeping silent
     
  17. solaria_

    solaria_ Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 2022
    Messages:
    201
    Likes Received:
    1,170
    Reading List:
    Link
    They cannot even understand Ines in the first place and just put their ideals on her. The manhwa so far hasn't given too much story about any of the characters yet (except Oscar) and people acting they know it all. Last week someone mentioned "story is tragedy about Ines and Emiliani cuz they can't be together" :blobjoy::blobjoy: This weeks chapter must be fun for them :p

    I noticed that some people shitting on Carcel have managed to lose their comprehension abilities too. Cuz most of the time they mix his character with Oscar or intentionally read his scenes like he is villain.

    One of the troll showed up but people shut him down.

    They would have really too much time on their hand if they keep reading it with intention of hating Carcel. But I am sure they will disappear soon and we will enjoy the story peacefully.
     
  18. PattyCakes

    PattyCakes Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2021
    Messages:
    821
    Likes Received:
    3,271
    Reading List:
    Link
    I think I know which one. They kept misreading and saying Carcel mad at being called a cheater :blobawkward: Losing comprehension like you said
     
  19. solaria_

    solaria_ Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 2022
    Messages:
    201
    Likes Received:
    1,170
    Reading List:
    Link
    That person is a complete troll and I've seen them on other manhwas to just hate reading and even saying horrible stuff about authors. Just completely ruing mood of readers. Plus he is Ruve (abandoned empress) apologist. Anyone who prefer Ruve over Carcel deserve no sympathy from fans :blobhero:
     
  20. PattyCakes

    PattyCakes Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2021
    Messages:
    821
    Likes Received:
    3,271
    Reading List:
    Link
    I don't hate Ruve too but he not better than Carcel. He cheated on Tia in previous life too and it was AFTER marriage and raped her too. I excuse they different in another tl but Tia had ptsd and shouldnt be healed that way just to end up with him again. Better to have separate lives after. He's like Oscar here and it would be like Ines forgivng Oscar and marrying him again :confused: