LCD Death Mage

Discussion in 'Latest Chapter Discussion' started by lygarx, May 21, 2017.

  1. xacual

    xacual Well-Known Member

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    It was stated in the story that he got his memories back right away because he had grown used to keeping his memories and doing his thinking purely in his soul rather than in his body due to the events in origin. Which is why he wasn’t limited by his body’s stats preventing him from accessing his previous life memories like the other reincarnated.
     
  2. CountryMage

    CountryMage [XSanguine8] not my blood...

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    He doesn't have a Death Magic affinity, affinities are soul add-ons, Van had to brute force his training of magic. Thanks to the researchers at that lab, he had all his mana converted over to Death mana, but still didn't have an affinity, even though their reason for dredging his soul was the theory that if they couldn't find an affinity, then it must be for something they hadn't detected before.
     
  3. Darquesse

    Darquesse Well-Known Member

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    Yep, without the trace amounts of "demon kings mana" in the fractured crevices of his soul, there was no chance of him developing the death attribute.
     
  4. Arha

    Arha Well-Known Member

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    Wah? If he didn't have an affinity for death magic he couldn't use it. Do you mean he has no real skill for it, like Zadiris said? The researchers couldn't measure his affinity for other types of magic because he has none and the tests aren't designed to pick up on something nobody has ever heard of. In fact, it's strongly implied that death magic and all the other attributes are mutually exclusive. They'd never seen someone with death magic before so he came up as having no magical affinities at all, which they judged to be impossible, so they experimented on him to see if there was an attribute he COULD use. They did forcibly remove the Eighth Guidance's natural attributes, which gave them limited death magic. Is that what you're thinking of? But that's not the same as what happened to Van.

    Basically, it's like how Amemiya's son discovered no attribute magic. It always existed, but no one had discovered it before. Death magic was always POSSIBLE but no one could use it. Kinda wonder if time magic is genuinely not possible in Origin or if it's just undiscovered as well. If people don't have a test to measure something they have to assume it doesn't exist.

    I don't know if it was stated explicitly, but I think the idea is that Zakkart and the other champion's broken soul fragments were flooded with death mana much like how the unborn Mei was, thus forcibly altering their affinities.
     
  5. CountryMage

    CountryMage [XSanguine8] not my blood...

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    No, he has no talents at all, this includes magic affinites. Any affinity at all would have made him capable of using magic from the start, but since he had none, he just had to pour massive amounts of magic into every spell he knew he should be capable of. It's like with No Attribute, he's just using magic manipulation to force an effect.
     
  6. Arha

    Arha Well-Known Member

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    That's not how it works. You have to have an affinity with a certain type of magic to be able to use it. Your aptitude is a measure of how good you are at that magic. Kachia, for example, has an affinity for like four different attributes but as a human her aptitude was so low that it meant nothing. Becoming a ghoul made her better at magic because they have a racial bonus.

    So Van does have an affinity for death magic. He just has mediocre aptitude for it, so if he didn't have so much mana his growth with it would be pretty slow because he wouldn't be able to use it as much.

    Actually, I may be misunderstanding your position. I don't want to argue with a strawman I built for myself rather than what you're trying to say. Could you please clarify exactly what you mean?
     
  7. CountryMage

    CountryMage [XSanguine8] not my blood...

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    There may be an affinity for Death attribute, but Van doesn't have it, he just has a massive amount of mana. So he poured a lot of time and mana into learning what he did, since Death magic was something he had experience with already. He learned it as a skill in Lambda when he was three months old, but he still doesn't have an actual talent for it, just a skill correction from job skills.
     
  8. X07Zero

    X07Zero Well-Known Member

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    Affinity is what you can do
    Skill is how good you are at it

    Van has an affinity for Death attribute means he can change his mana(non-attribute) to death mana.
    for other attribute, he can't do that, that why he can't use other attribute spells at all

    In the beginning, he brute-forces the lack of skill with his massive mana.
     
  9. CountryMage

    CountryMage [XSanguine8] not my blood...

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    His mana is already changed to Death attribute, he doesn't have the talent to change it to that, just Skill.
     
  10. X07Zero

    X07Zero Well-Known Member

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    Uuuuu, I'm sleepy T_T

    from chapter 13

    "As its name suggests, no-attribute magic is magic that uses Mana before it has changed into any attribute. Since no attributes are involved, anyone can use this magic as long as they have Mana"

    "The task of maintaining Mana in its original form, shaping it and then casting a spell was more difficult than Vandalieu had thought. When he used death-attribute magic, he applied the attribute to his Mana unconsciously, so it was difficult not to do that automatically."
     
  11. CountryMage

    CountryMage [XSanguine8] not my blood...

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    Yeah, and how long has he been using magic at that point, just on Lambda? It was a skill, and now it's ingrained habit.
     
  12. Mastine

    Mastine Well-Known Member

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    I think this argument is about terminology. Attribute, Affinity, Skill, etc.
    Van can only use Death magic and no attribute because those are the magics his soul is steeped in.
    His growth is very low and he made up for it with otherworld knowledge and massive MP.
     
  13. CountryMage

    CountryMage [XSanguine8] not my blood...

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    Okay, here is where I am coming from on this, on Lambda they know about No Attribute magic, and as a consequence they understand mana conversion. A skilled mage can convert their non attribute mana to any element they want, but if they have a talent this conversion is happens naturally. It's still no attribute but they put out fire, unless they consciously avoid it for instance. On Origin they lack the concept of mana conversion, they only rely on the talents, and they ingrained this on Van. He thought he only had Death, and so he only used Death until the system gave him a Skill for it. Now it's a bad habit, like how he kills his presence constantly.
     
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  14. Feng Tian

    Feng Tian Well-Known Member

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    The very concept might not even exist in Origin. It is a different system after all. Otherwise I would be very surprised they haven't found it yet given that they know the scientific method and it is somewhat important...

    Van's groth is sheer insanity because he bypasses any limitations which would otherwise affect him. Vida removed all barriers while his pets and minions farm exp for him and ever since he ascended to divinity he can basically eat, sleep and shit and still outgrow even the most talented mortals. At this point its "GG" simply because the gods have no effective way of attacking him while he is quickly approaching overgod levels of power.
     
  15. anteopta

    anteopta Well-Known Member

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    where was that? chapter please, I want to reread it, because i don't remember it at all. And I am quite confident in my memory.
     
  16. Arha

    Arha Well-Known Member

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    This is incorrect. The way it is explained somewhere early is that there is affinity and aptitude, regardless of what world you are in. Though I might be getting it backward from the way the story uses these terms.

    If you have an affinity for an aptitude, you can convert your own non attributed mana to this attribute. Kachia, for example, has an affinity for four elements, but her aptitude is very low, meaning as a human she still couldn't use those attributes. Zandia, meanwhile, has an affinity for all the elements apart from death magic as well as high aptitude, meaning she can use all those attributes. She cannot use death magic, however. If you threw her into Origin and made her undergo one of those tests, she would show up as capable of using every attribute, but would not show up as being able to time magic because that attribute doesn't exist in Origin. But that doesn't necessarily mean she can't use time magic, it means the test isn't designed to measure that. The test also isn't designed to measure death magic, so Van showed up as being unable to use ANY attribute.

    Van did have to learn to stop automatically converting his mana to the death attribute so he could learn no attribute magic. From this step, however, he would be able to use fire magic if he had an affinity for that element. He does not. He'd be trying if he could. What he is brute forcing when it comes to magic is that he lacks technical skill with mana. He's very inefficient, so where a more talented mage could cast spell A for 100 mana, he has to use like 10000 or more. He's spending 100x more than they are, but since he has 10000x the amount of mana of even a pretty good mage it doesn't really matter.
     
  17. Zamzukan

    Zamzukan Well-Known Member

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    As far as i remember, it is stated in the story that Origin and Lambda magic systems are diffrent with an overlapp in the elemental department.
    Is it possible, that reserchers in origin created the Death atribute through sheer power of belief? Wealredy know belief works on gods, so why not on magic. Reserchers were copletly covinced of the existance of a new magic it just manifested as Death magic, it might have pulled from traces of a simmilar energy in Van's soul.
    And when Van reincarnated into Lambda, the system created a new skill for the magic he wielded. No one before him had the death magic skill, the first Demon king was not part of the system, so the system had nearly no refference for it, also DK was known as powerfull and able to destroy souls and nothing else Van does with "Death magic"
     
  18. CountryMage

    CountryMage [XSanguine8] not my blood...

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    That's the point, Rod told him he had no affinity, and that without affinity it was impossible to use magic. He told him that his massive mana capacity would go to waste, and like most things he was wrong. Van has no affinity, not even to Death, but since he already knows how to convert to Death he's using it like No Attribute.
     
  19. Arha

    Arha Well-Known Member

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    No. He has an affinity for the death attribute. You can't cast magic you don't have an affinity for. He is not capable of converting his mana to the fire attribute or whatever. If he could, Vida would have been able to let him use life magic with her divine blessing, but his own death attribute Noped that.
     
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  20. tirirism

    tirirism Mad-ness Monster

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    Going by the fact that Death magic is a passive skill for Van compared to everyone else we have seen with their magics in the Active skill list, I'd say Rodcock fucked something up like always and didn't cancel Van's affinity to Death magic. Or maybe he didn't know about the Death attribute and it was a byproduct of a soul with a fuckton of mana having an absolute zero affinity to all other forms of magic. Either way, Death attribute is in Van's nature (passive skill). He seems to be able to cancel the "Deathlyness" of his mana to use No-Attribute magic but he is unable to use other forms of elemental magic because of his nature.