Spoiler Desolate Era Confusion

Discussion in 'Spoilers' started by Khrysaes, Oct 20, 2016.

  1. Khrysaes

    Khrysaes Well-Known Member

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    First, this is my first new thread on the forums, which i have been lurking in for quite some time. Second, If this is in the wrong location, please move it to the appropriate one, I apologize. I also didn't want to put it into the DE discussion because of the specificity of the question, as well as the potential spoilers. This way allowed me to keep better track of it, as well as add the spoiler tag.

    During Desolate Era, especially after the conclave when Ning was a Waxiang adept, it keeps referring to "When Nuwa reached Pangu's level."

    However, in the most recently translated volume, it finally gave a breakdown of how the Daofathers work, at least to some extent.
    • All Daofather's have mastered at least 1 Heavenly Dao.
    • There are 10 Heavenly Daos, in 4 tiers.
    • T1: Chaos(Pangu had this)
    • T2: Life/Destruction
    • T3: Yin/Yang
    • T4: Fire, Earth, Water, Air, Metal.
    • The more Heavenly Daos a Daofather masters, the stronger they are.
    • Opposing Daos give a stronger boost(Life/Destruction, and Yin/Yang), than learning a new Dao that isn't the opposing one. So the Yin/Yang combo should be stronger than Life/Fire, for example.
    So Pangu was the last Elder god to come into creation, and did so having mastered the Heavenly Dao of Chaos. Upon which he apparently immediately killed himself by cutting the Primordial chaos into the Heavens and Earth, creating the Primodial world upon which he died.

    Nuwa on the other hand, came into existence having mastered the Dao of Life. She then, not killing herself, mastered Yin, Yang, and the 5 elements, which is 8 of the 10 Heavenly Daos, 2 of which oppose each other, and I think there is a special aspect of mastering all the elements and becoming the true avatar. But it wasn't until the war with the Seemless World, and when Nuwa mastered the Dao of Chaos, that it is said she reached Pangu's level.

    So my confusion is; Is the Dao of Chaos, so strong that it alone beats out 8 of the other 9 daos combined? and did Nuwa become equal to Pangu? or did she actually surpass him since she had 9 of the 10 daos, including Chaos?
     
  2. negritis

    negritis The Mathematician

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    the chaos is the dao of the "creation" of that universe
    so that should have the strongest effect there
    and i think its way stonger then the other dao's so Nuwa just reached the same level as pangu
     
  3. Khrysaes

    Khrysaes Well-Known Member

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    that is a dumb power curve.... but thank you
     
  4. Saint

    Saint 圣人

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    If we go by actual Chinese mythology...

    Pangu was born within the primordial chaos (混沌), which was essentially a Cosmic Egg. With a great axe, he cleaved through the egg and escaped (but eventually died from the exertion). This wasn't a simple swing of his axe; it actually split apart Yin and Yang which had previously been fused / perfectly balanced. Once dissociated from each other, the greater portion of Yang (light and ethereal) rose up and became the Heavens, while the greater portion of Yin (dark and heavy) sunk down to become the Earth. From there, everything in the universe was born from the Heavens, Earth, and the new interactions between Yin and Yang.

    So just from this, we can see that Primordial Chaos is on a higher level than Yin and Yang. Think of it as splitting an atom into its components, with Yin being electrons and Yang being protons. Not a perfect analogy, but you get the idea.

    There's a famous quote from Laozi which goes something like "The Dao gave birth to One. One gave birth to Two. Two gave birth to Three. Three gave birth to 10 thousand things."
    It describes the process of how everything in the universe came into being. There are many interpretations on what One/Two/Three are supposed to mean.
    "One" is probably Taiji ("Supreme Ultimate") or maybe even the Dao itself (the idea being that the Dao spontaneously birthed itself). "Two" is definitely Yin and Yang. "Three" is difficult. Maybe it's the Three Realms (Heaven/Earth/Mortal realms), maybe it's the Three Treasures (Essence/Qi/Spirit), or maybe it's the intermingling of Yin+Yang+the WuXing born from them. Whatever the case, the Three give birth to the "10 thousand things" (万物), which figuratively refers to everything else in the universe. (Just like in English with the word "myriad", 万 can mean 10000 or an indefinitely large number.)

    But what if the "One" is Primordial Chaos? I think it's a valid interpretation since Yin and Yang (the "Two") came from it - according to the Pangu myth. If that's so, then think of the Heavenly Daos from Desolate Era...

    Primordial Chaos, Yin/Yang, Life/Destruction, & the Five Elements.
    Primordial Chaos is supreme because everything else ultimately originated from it. (The Five Elements come from the intermingling of Yin&Yang according to Chinese mythology, and everyone/everything in the universe is composed of the Five Elements.) So... Primordial Chaos > Yin/Yang > Five Elements. As for Life/Destruction, I think IET just added them to get a nice round 10 Heavenly Daos, since Life/Destruction should merely be aspects of Yin/Yang if we go by mythology. But if they have to be added to the hierarchy, they are probably either equal to Yin/Yang or fall in between Yin/Yang and the Five Elements.


    tl;dr
    Yes, it's possible that Primordial Chaos is greater than or equal in strength to the 9 other Heavenly Daos combined, since it's the origin of everything - even those Heavenly Daos. This is assuming IET doesn't deviate too much from Chinese mythology, so I could be wrong.
     
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  5. TheZephyrStorm

    TheZephyrStorm Rock God

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    He won't be staying with Chinese myths for too lon since he's already begun introducing aliens. If you want me to explain the IET lore of the creation of the three realms, I can
     
  6. ThunderGod

    ThunderGod Well-Known Member

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    When they talk about "Pangu's level" it means the cultivation rank.
    E.g. Nuwa will have reached the same rank as Pangu but their strengths are not the same as they hold different Laws.

    More of a Rank One ---> Rank Two meaning
     
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  7. itdontevenmatteruknow

    itdontevenmatteruknow Well-Known Member

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    Actually mother nuwa reaching pangus level is actually his level. Dao of chaos is strongest so even tho she learned 7 or 8 other daos it doesnt matter.
    Think like this:
    Chaos= hydrogen bomb
    Yin/yang= atom bomb
    Remaining daos= lower level bombs

    When u can use hydrogen bomb ( not like earth where u have all countries banning it) why whould u knowing how to use lower level bombs matter???

    Like if u know heartforce lv 4 - lv3 heartforce don't matter at all.

    When u know ultimate shit - lower level stuff don't matter.
     
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  8. Khrysaes

    Khrysaes Well-Known Member

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    in one of the recently translated chapters since I asked this question, it brought up a part that i forgot.
    In the primordial chaos, only the dao of chaos actually works. So all 10 of the elder gods, being born, pangu was born last. That means that the other 9 popped into existence, and couldnt do anything until pangu was born and cleaved the chaos, creating the heavens, and thus the heavenly and earth, a place the rest of the Daos worked. So maybe its just that pangu, and nuwa, could enact their power outside of the 3 realms.
     
  9. Robinhood1

    Robinhood1 *The Mood breaker*

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    Primordial Chaos is always the strongest in any novel it is mentioned. The whole of universe if created from the chaos, so ruling/mastering it allows u to have the power to create/destroy worlds as easy as flipping ur hand. Also, all of the things are created from chaos, including yin/yang etc ...
     
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  10. AardwarkThe2nd

    AardwarkThe2nd (R-18 writer) Aardwark, the king of aardvarks!

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    Pangu actually reached the realm of World God when he was born. He died when he split open the Primordial World to establish the the Three Realms. Nuwa was originally a Elder God, but she broke through to World God before leaving the Three Realms.

    Source: MTL
     
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  11. DeathStroke96

    DeathStroke96 『President of Sindria Trading Co.』『Uncle』『GOD』

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    You should not take anything said during the first 23 volumes to heart because three realms is a
    backward place in a huge universe where they dont even have proper understanding of Dao and assume that heavenly Dao is the most supreme however it is not in reality is only something needed to become a world god and after that if a cultivator still sticks to it they would not be able to advance so think of it as a grand dao for those below daofather (aka ancient immortal/god). When a cultivator reaches world god they will start comprehending complete dao which is basically like sword force once they have completed one and chosen it as their main dao then they will stride into dao lord which will make them comprehend even more of these complete dao to infuse into their main chosen one to make it even better and when they reach the fourth level they will have to fuse and if they fail they will die in 1billion years and if they succeed they will truly become immortal and never die unless killed and start comprehending ruler dao or eternal dao or ultimate dao. Also let me state that one a person reaches the sovereign level (cultivation realm, and they differ in power those who only grasp ruler dao are know as ruler sovereigns, those grasp eternal dao are called eternal sovereigns and those who grasp ultimate dao (Ji Ning is the first inventor By the way and there only exist ultimate sword dao and no other ultimate dao) are called ultimate sovereigns, they will be able to create new dao which can then devolve and split into even more dao (sort of like a pyramid the top being the newly created one e.g ultimate sword split into eternal sword dao with different elements which can be split into ruler sword dao with even more elements and lower level of course then it will be split into sword force, then grand dao of the sword and so on...)
    i hope that this gibberish has been helpful on your understanding of the Dao in DE... by the be careful only the first two lines are about the 3r and the rest about the dao and cultivation levels in DE which corresponds to dao...
     
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