Spoiler Discussion in Spoiler Threads

Discussion in 'Spoilers' started by Westeller, Oct 9, 2020.

  1. Westeller

    Westeller The superior sibling Staff Member

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    This subforum is supposed to be a place enthusiastic readers can share and discuss spoilers - untranslated content -, openly, without concern for people who do not want to be spoiled. This is a place for like minded people, where you don’t have to use spoiler tags for every post you make. Where you don’t have to worry about others giving you a hard time for mentioning something that hasn’t happened yet.

    It’s supposed to be, anyway.

    Instead, it’s a place to argue. It’s a place to fight. Not about your favorite characters or the fantastic pairing you can’t seem to convince anyone else about. No. This is a place to bicker and chew each other out for discussing spoilers. A place to fight over whether or not someone *can* discuss the spoilers shared in this subforum, or whether this subforum is *only* for sharing spoilers.

    Well, let me set the record straight.

    You can. You absolutely can. That’s what this subforum is for.

    Sharing, and discussing.

    There is nowhere else on the forums you can go to do either of these things without using the appropriate spoiler tags. There is nowhere else you are supposed to go. There is nowhere else we will make you go. If you have an opinion to share on something that happens past the current translation of a novel, you are exactly where you are supposed to be.

    Now, I understand that people who come to this subforum looking for spoilers are having issues finding them. You’re having to dig through pages of discussion you don’t care about to find the posts actually sharing spoilers. I don’t want to downplay that issue. We’re aware of it and we’re trying to figure out a solution.

    If you have any ideas, feel free to share them here. Keep in mind that anything requiring fundamental changes to the forums is presently implausible, but feel free to suggest those changes anyway.

    In the mean time, there are things you can do to help each other. Opening posts, if you create a new thread, can be updated with links to new spoilers, or quotes of them. Posts sharing spoilers can be highlighted somehow - be creative, if you have to be. Every once in awhile someone can compile the spoilers into one post. Even without changing the rules or changing the way the forums work, you have options. Make use of them.

    If you have an opinion on this, you can discuss it in this thread. Any further posts on the topic made in spoiler threads will be moved here. Spoiler threads are for the sharing and discussing of spoilers, and nothing else. Anything beyond that is actually off topic, and will be moved to the appropriate place or deleted.
     
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  2. araarq

    araarq Well-Known Member

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    An idea i think might be helpful is that there should be an option on a thread to mark a post as spoiler related, and make an option to have all these marked post have links to them on page 1, similar to a table of contents. Something similar to the second post in this thread about quick transmigration heroine arrives woman rapidly retreats. Hope this helps.
     
  3. kawaii12345

    kawaii12345 Well-Known Member

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  4. ARaine

    ARaine Well-Known Member

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    Agree. Anyone who goes here should be prepared to be spoiled. I just often use spoiler tags for the spoilers so it will be organized and easier find.

    Here is my suggestion. The thread starter, upon making the thread, should also add 3 or 2 empty posts. These posts will only say, "-Reserve for spoilers-" or something like that. When real spoilers do show up, these empty posts can be edited and added links to the actual spoiler pages OR someone can copy the spoilers, paste it, clean it with unnecessary stuff (remove those discussions and leave the spoilers), give credit to the spoiler giver, and post.
     
  5. Shio

    Shio Moderator Staff Member

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    Tbh, discussion is actually ok in spoiler thread. The problem comes when user start to fight endlessly over a certain topic. We all know arguments that sounds like this:

    A: ml is xxxx because he yyy. He's such an xxxxx and ruined the novel for me.

    B: he's ok tho. Why you gotta bring up the same topic over and over again? Freakin xxx

    A: ML is xxxxx. How can you forgive that? People like you are xxxx for allowing this happen

    B: no, it's you who's xxxx. Anyway, MC is yyy, and hhhh happened in previously life. A is such a xxxxx.

    Repeat for the next several pages.

    C: can you guys calm down and discuss elsewhere?
     
  6. Sheri_Yui_Chan

    Sheri_Yui_Chan Cute, handsome Oppa & sweet Noona [Chaos fam]

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    I sometimes wonder why people say spoilers about a novel shouldn't be said in a spoilers thread when I go there specifically to read spoilers it's annoying.

    Those who don't want to be spoiled about a novels should go to LCD or Discussion thread. I see it would be a better options for them or maybe in the spoiler thread pin the message for those who don't want to know spoilers please go to the discussion thread of the novel. Or something like that.

    And maybe a separate thread should be created to discuss or debate or argue or persecute the liked/disliked or controversial characters of such and such novels.
     
    Last edited: Oct 10, 2020
  7. theilikepie

    theilikepie Well-Known Member

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    20201010_013729.jpg


    "Ahem"

    I'd like to dedicate this moment to all the people who told me to "gUyZ PlEaSe DiScUsS tHiS iN tHe DiScCuSioN tHrEad"

    And to those who tagged mods to get people banned and succeeded more then once

    I also liked to partially dedicate this to those who used passive agressinvess and clogged up the thread on telling people to move to other threads
     
  8. zloi medved

    zloi medved Well-Known Green Tea Bitch

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    I don't really have a problem with people doing discussions in spoiler threads. It's just frustrating when it's just discussions of the latest translated chapters only. That's what the LCD is for, and it seems like the happier option for people trying to discuss these chapters without being nagged and chastised, and for people who want spoilers not latest chapter discussion.

    Community actions are the only things I can think of, but I can also immediately counter-argue why these things wouldn't work.
    This is a great idea, but also requires that thread OPs must dedicate time and effort to curating ongoing threads. Some people just want spoilers without having to moderate threads, or will forget they made threads and "abandon" them. A lot of threads do not even include links to the novel (raws or NU), just the name and synopsis (sometimes not even the synopsis). These are threadmakers that are gonna be curating a spoiler directory y'know. Also, a thread that's 4 pages or 12 long is fine to curate like this, but what about the spoiler threads that are well into 80+ pages or or even 100+? Every now and then people posting in the thread, not the OP, may try to compile things into a single thread, but again, if the thread is dozens of pages long, and the post with compilations of spoilers is 38 pages in, and the OP has abandoned the thread and not editing their OP...

    Obviously, doing something is better than griping about how it wouldn't work, I'm just an annoying pessimist. As a generalised suggestion I like the idea of people within the thread curating spoiler directories, but since only people who make posts can edit them (or mods?), it means one person has to be dedicatedly in charge of curating the entire thread...

    You said that fundamental changes to the way forums work aren't feasible but can be suggested anyway -- so a way to set a "communal post" that can be edited by more than one person would help. Maybe if people need to have posted in the thread at least once or have x number of posts made like posting links require, before they're allowed. Some people may troll edit it, but this is the internet, people will always troll.

    Another might be just encouraging people to mark their own posts as spoilers beyond just using a spoiler tag, since a spoiler tag doesn't always indicate spoilers. I've seen people use it to hide speculative discussion for example. Even just for, I dunno, threads for Korean webnovels+webtoons which are notoriously hard to get raws of and lead to the bulk of threads that are just 12 pages of people asking "spoilers? +1? Spoilers??" interspersed between back and forth arguing about the merits of ML archetypes, normalising people self-indicating spoiler posts with, idk
    SPOILER POST
    or whatever so it's easy to spot as you're skimming quickly through the discussion would be really helpful.
    The pitfall of course being this again demands community self-curation. I mean I guess if some people started doing that, more and more people might pick it up idk...

    A baked in way to self-tag posts or highlight your post quickly, like how new posts have that little "new" tag in the corner, would also help. The convenience of just pressing a button to mark your post as a spoiler may encourage people to do so?
     
  9. ATrueStory

    ATrueStory Villainesses, Historical Shit, Noble Circuses

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    Suggestions

    - Threadmarks. I think is better especially if there are many people who spoil. More often, I have seen people who spoil first but drops it. We can't force people to spoil so at least there is already an ongoing list on what is spoiled and what is not. I think this is also better to declutter threads. Also better for people who are discussing to fact check.

    - Flair. Kinda like reddit. People can tag their post as Spoiler and readers can just click that and they can read the spoiler to their content. Same goes for people who like to discuss. Tag discuss and people can see what has been discussed. I could also suggest a flair for posts discussing opinion pieces/posts, unrelated content, harassment or abuse. I think this would be helpful for the mods. Like I said, declutter, declutter, declutter

    - Megathread/Sticky post/Pinned Spoiler. I think this was mentioned above but it is better to have this sticky note so that in every page, some readers can access the spoiler megathread/sticky post. God knows how many posts were made because some readers prefer to read on the last page, compared to the first. Thsi could be helpful for newcomers who don't want to read 30+ post threads.

    - FAQ. I think this would also be a good feature on the sticky note. FAQ contains the usual questions answered by the people who do the spoilers. Should include recurring questions like who is the ML, who is the MC, Happy ending?, applicable genre/tags, trigger warnings, differences between novels vs manga, side stories etc.

    I get that some fo these suggestions won't make it. But, this is improvements that i could imagine. Hopefully, at least one could be realized someday.

    Okay, going back to work.
     
  10. ARaine

    ARaine Well-Known Member

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    Yes. I also thought that thread starters need to be active for it to happen, which not everyone got time for that. :( So I'm thinking either...

    1. Anyone can edit those 2 or 3 reserved posts. (Yes, I see trolls and chaos if this happens.)
    2. Any volunteer curator can message the thread starter or a mod to add the directory she/he made on the reserved posts. I know I saw some volunteers made a directory, which I find really helpful. Sadly, it's hidden on a mountain of pages. I would have preferred to see it in page 1 or 2, next to the thread starter opening/ first post.

    I'm thinking also a special button to upvote a spoiler making it more visible to spoiler hunters. Sadly, you still need to skim through pages to find that sweet spot and this will need coding as well.

    Anyways, it just a suggestion. Hope it helps though :blobsmile:
     
  11. Westeller

    Westeller The superior sibling Staff Member

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    You could make a new account called SpoilerCurator or some shit and publicize the password.

    Post edits are logged and can be reverted if necessary.
     
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  12. Xing

    Xing Well-Known Member

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    Forum > Novels > Novel Discussion -> make a thread there with all caps SPOILER DISCUSSION
    Idm if some people discuss abit but when it's getting longer and longer and become argument - talk bout humanity of the character blah blah blah - it's a "character" why the need argue on that smh
    Last time i'm complaining bout discussion in a spoiler my post got deleted so yeah idc what u guys gonna do
     
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  13. SamSam

    SamSam class' ...pas class' !

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    I like to comment and read comments from other readers. But I dont like those who make pseudo-literary criticisms writing an essay or loooooooooong speeches of moral ... or attacking other readers for free; Everyone has their own tastes bordel !
    I suggest to add a button like the spoiler but that would be called 'my thoughts' or something like this...It leaves room for everyone : for those who want to express themselves at length can do so without others having to read cobblestones of nothing!
     
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  14. Belli

    Belli PRO-crastinator Corgy

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    Can the TS kick/delete those post that trolling/ derail the topic/making way too pointless argument about moral ethics/somehow connecting (and make a long argument/discuss them) about other novel that's not even related whatsoever?

    Sometimes it's annoying to see ppl saying:

    1.WOAAAH GUYS??? TOO MUCH SPOILER HERE! Well, there is big tag of spoiler for a reason. Ppl only open this thread to see whatever spoiler in the particular title u look.

    2. 'I hate XXX character! He is rapey to the FL! Rape is not good!' or 'Eeeww, i just read to chapter 24/1000, and realize they rape/kill a random cannon fooder! I will not read this anymore! U all read till the end is sickened disgusting f**k!'
    Ok, rape/kill irl maybe bad (let's not delve into this matter too much), but u do realize this is novel r8??? If u cannot treat this as fiction and think it's way too much, be our guest to just close the app, or find other mild tag novels. Why ruin other's reading experience here? It's not as if everyone is idiots who will do whatever ML/villain do irl.

    3. 'OMG! The character YYY in YYYnovel is like LLL in LLLnovel (not even same author)!!' , then somehow this LLLfans can manage to make huge long wall of text about that LLLnovel and LLL good marks in YYYnovel thread. When u tried to reroute the topic back, somehow this LLLfans can still answer 'yes! Just like LLL!'

    4. 'I'm the translator of this novel, and i demand u to not spoil the story!'. Ey... Nobody spoiler it in ur web comment page k? And this is spoiler section.

    On 2nd thought, TS might be just make a thread then goes MIA. So there is no point giving TS such ability to delete or kick. Sometimes when these trollers come, i just get out of the thread. I'm not even have the energy to reply. Or when i have the mood, I'll trolled them back with even more detailed spoiler trollers don't want to see but others might.

    On serious note, spoiler and discussion section sometimes can be a little gray area and a bit mushed up, so rather than separate it, better to join them together, but the spoiler post need tags that can be link, so the 1st page is contained some links to those spoiler page (to prevent looking for spoiler in the page 660 out of 1000).
    Or maybe 1 thread title than can be open to 2/3 subfolder, 1 for spoiler, 2nd is discussion, 3rd for question post. If u post something with spoiler tag it will automatically goes to spoiler folder. The normal 1 will go to discussion, question tag will go to Q folder. Whatever u want fight (fav char, moral integrity, author's brain damage plot) will be discussion folder. Whatever thank u for spoiler, asking for more, asking about xxx character post will go to the question folder.

    Or, make a setting where u can check/uncheck choice box of:
    1. show all post,
    2. show only spoiler tag,
    3. show only discussion tag,
    4. show only question tag
    Filter urself what u want to see

    And maybe option to add tag to other's post. Sometimes in moment of heat of discussions, their post contain spoiler. Poster maybe didn't realized it, but reader can add tag for future reference. These double tag posts will show up in both spoiler tag/discussions tag only.
     
    Last edited: Oct 10, 2020
  15. Gumiho

    Gumiho Villainess Connoisseur ❤

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    Hi There!
    Just to clarify, are you saying it is alright to open up a more informative thread if the initial Spoilers thread keeps devolving into chaos / initial thread owner is not maintaining it? I was under the impression that most tended to frown upon duplicates of an existing spoiler thread.
     
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  16. SakuraHana

    SakuraHana Well-Known Member

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    Then make a thread for spoiler discussion. Because people here likes to discuss about humanity morality n other bs that doesn't have anything to do with spoilers at all. And over drawn "discussions" about, Why you quote me when I just said my opinion, I quote you because your opinion is wrong, then let's see who is right or wrong.
     
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  17. ATrueStory

    ATrueStory Villainesses, Historical Shit, Noble Circuses

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    You made quite a bingo. Cant approve and like this enough.
    On filtering, it's just like the tags I mentioned. The problem I'm seeing is people not tagging or not tagging appropriately. Some people just jump into the thread and reply
     
  18. Belli

    Belli PRO-crastinator Corgy

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    Give more button (add tag) beside post reply and make them cannot post without inserting at least 1 tag
     
  19. Westeller

    Westeller The superior sibling Staff Member

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    Hmmm. Not casually or arbitrarily. We'll merge duplicate threads if they seem unnecessary. If the old thread is really bad, though... Well, I know Shio locked one the other day because it kept getting out of hand. Do keep in mind that people discussing in the old thread are probably going to come right along to the new thread, so it seems like the only real benefit to making a new one is the chance to organize the opening post yourself.
     
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  20. Elste

    Elste Well-Known Member

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    Sorry in advance, English isn't my first language. I don't really have a problem with the disccussions about spoilers. However, I think there should be a heavy moderation about it.

    1- Overall, sometimes people compare on novel to another and this shouldn't be done in a spoiler post. It summons people from X novel to Y novel in a Y based disccussion and in the long run it doesn't contribute to the spoiler thread.

    2- Hate speech should be banned. It's okay to no agree with the X character ending, is okay to signal de plotholes or inconsistencies done by the authors, or express dissatisfaction towards Y plot and explaining the reasons why you may drop the novel. What is not okay is things like: OMG I was hoping that X character gets raped or stuff like that.

    3- There should be 2 additional (insert square) tags: one for theories since sometimes spoilers aren't clear due mtl or stuff like that, and other for opinions about the potential spoilers.

    Overall, this is about people. It gets super boring to check spoiler threads filled with the same 3/4 individuals complaining over the same thing over and over again. But, at some point those individuals aren't adding anything to the disscussion/spoiler thread and just discouraging other people that are actually looking for spoilers.
     
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