Discussion Do people have a right to complain in comments?

Discussion in 'Novel General' started by UnGrave, Apr 25, 2020.

?

Vote on the situation:

  1. Free speech is important. Every non-spam comment should be left as is.

    35 vote(s)
    39.8%
  2. Translators have the right to block comments as they feel. It is their domain.

    33 vote(s)
    37.5%
  3. Translations shouldn't have comment sections anymore. They are worthless.

    1 vote(s)
    1.1%
  4. You didn't present the topic correctly. I want to take a crack at it myself. (comment below)

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  5. I actually don't care. Comments are fleeting, and I don't interact with them.

    8 vote(s)
    9.1%
  6. Get back to work, slave!

    11 vote(s)
    12.5%
  1. UnGrave

    UnGrave I really like Nanahira

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    Every once in a while I see a comment saying something like "wow, this is really cliche. " or "this novel sucks. dropped." after sometimes a decent number of chapters into the story. Sometimes the comment has valid criticism like if the author misunderstood a topic they were writing on, or if the story had repeated the same style of arc too many times in a row, or something else along those lines. My question is whether or not you think it would be wrong for a translator to go through and block that sort of comment from appearing on their chapters? Do people have a right to be able to publicly complain about a novel in such a way that it could influence whether other readers wish to continue reading? This does not include external discussions, like on NU.

    What do you think? Should people have the freedom to say what they want to in the comments of novels? The author will never hear it, so the only ones who will be affected are the translator and the readers.
     
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  2. Ricelord

    Ricelord Well-Known Member

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    If the world was made of people who liked to actually discuss instead of watching others suffer and staring into mirrors complimenting themselves, then the world would already be a better place.
     
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  3. lnv

    lnv ✪ Well-Known Hypocrite

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    Do they have a right? Yes. Do translators have a right to delete it or change it to a comment about superiority of cats? Also a yes.

    People are free to say whatever they want, but it's the translator's house, so its the translators rules.

    Now of course certain actions can have backlash and what not, but that is a different story.

    Though in general, I don't think it's a good thing to demotivate the translator by saying you would drop the novel. Because enough demotivate and we might have less and less translators. so while they have the right to do so, people should be mindful of their actions.
     
  4. Vudoodude

    Vudoodude Well-Known Member

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    People tend to forget that freedom of speech is only relative to government suppression of speech, therefore if a company or website have certain policies then your "freedom of speech" doesn't matter on their platform. People also tend to forget that freedom of speech does not mean that you are free from the consequences of your speech, and this is a lot more evident today where we see cancel culture blowing up on what celebrities say on social media. They have a right to say what they want, sure, but they will face the backlash from society.

    In terms of novels, I do feel like literature is a very opinionated subject, thus I would say anyone should be allowed to complain as much as they want. Mind you, everyone has a different threshold for things, so a hot topic like racism may be extraordinarily racist to one person, but another person may think of it as a little racist or just patriotism.

    What people shouldn't forget when making comments though is the purpose or intent behind it. Ultimately, any of these comments should be 1) to express joy or discontent towards something about the novel, and 2) to let others know why or what made them feel this way. This allows others who have yet to invest time into reading 10000 chapters to get an idea of whether the novel is for them or not. Thus, any comments that act contrary to this concept (i.e troll comments) should not be allowed as they are not helpful.
     
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  5. bakato

    bakato Well-Known Member

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    People have the right to complain and translators have the right to remove said complaints because they're not constructive.
     
  6. Arcadia Blade

    Arcadia Blade ༼ つ ◕_◕ ༽つ You can do it!!

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    Nope. I think the translator is just doing his job and let the haters translated their own novel.

    If they can tolerate MTL that is. :blobowoevil_horns:

    Translators are a good source of slave workers-i mean good citizens on the internet that helps in letting us translate novels and shouldn't be disrespected just because the novel they translate is bad. We owe them our gratitude to translate novels and should be praising them.

    Translated Novels are really hard to come by if your not good at their language and translators are doing the job for us. So, i prefer that they should translate faster-uh... Just continue translating and only praise their work rather than complain. :blobokhand:
     
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  7. AliceShiki

    AliceShiki 『Ms. Tree』『Aspect of Destruction』

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    Do they have a right to say it? Well, yes.

    Is there any point in saying it? Not really, it's not like this will reach the author anyways, might as well keep quiet about it.

    And do the translator have the right to delete the comment? Certainly, it's your site after all~
     
  8. Not Red Yet

    Not Red Yet Well-Known Member

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    :blob_coffee:Yes they have a right, they took the time to read the novel so of course they can state their opinion.

    I enjoy seeing people complain about a novel because it’s a whole lot better than seeing “Thanks for the chapter” over and over.

    Translators should remove the comments if it’s breaking rules like threatening someone and such but not if someone gives their opinion about why they don’t like the novel. Seen some translators remove comments pointing out plot holes and bad things about the novel and only leaving the good ones like “Great novel” “thanks for chapter”

    Edit: Just cause someone took the time to translate doesn’t mean others can’t give their opinion about said quality of translation and or novel, but I guess only mature adults would understand :blob_coffee::blob_coffee::blob_coffee:
     
  9. SAimNE

    SAimNE Well-Known Member

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    I'd say leave them be if it's not trolling or spam. I mean half the reason I've managed to stay with wortenia senki, through it's painfully slow bs in the last volume, is having fun mellowing out by reading other people tearing the author a new one in the comments.

    To clarify, the last chapter consisted of the mc walking into a court room, around 4 topics of monologues involving 1 background plot and weird views on trust, and him sighing. The end.

    In the previous chapter he started walking to the court room at the start of the chapter btw. So in 2 chapters he walked to a court room and sighed. If I didn't have the comments as a crutch I would have been irritated by that to a degree I may have dropped it. regardless of how much I've been holding out to see the plot, which is interesting without the drag, finally conclude.
     
    Last edited: Apr 25, 2020
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  10. Katsurandom

    Katsurandom [The One That Does Nothing][Villager C]

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    I am a shameless leachers i will not complain and unless the novel touches a soft spot most than likely i will never post a thing on comments, i will leave likes But if i wanna drop a novel i will not spare a second only to leave a rude (and meaningless) comment.....

    Since that is a waste of my time and a waste of time for those that are reading the comments
     
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  11. Anra7777

    Anra7777 All powerful magic grammar hamster queen pirate.

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    I complain about things in novels. Not all the time, but when I get really fed up by something. Complaining is a way to vent my feelings and to see if anyone else feels the same way. Actually, I complained in a chapter of a manga just today about how tired I was of seeing MCs forgive too easily, and that I wanted to see the MC actually get mad or upset about being threatened.

    Personally, I’d be more upset if my comments got deleted. It’s not like I’m dissing the translation. (If I do feel the translation is subpar, I either try to suggest politely they get a proofreader, or just silently drop it.) It’s not like I’m being a troll. I’ve had plenty of people twist my comments to suit their own narrative and then insult me, even calling me a “thot” once, if I’m remembering correctly. But they have the right to misunderstand me, and I have the right to point out their misunderstanding.

    Troll and spam comments should be deleted. Otherwise, I think they should stay.
     
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  12. haweii

    haweii [mad scientist in-training] Fujoshi

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    I am a supporter of the right of freely speaking out (except for spam and clearly intended malicious things).
    It more of my moral and political point of view, it ranges from what the government wants to ban till something like freedom of speech in comment sections.

    Even if there are those who enjoy criticizing everything and anything, in my eyes, it should still be allowed to express the opinion of the people, even if they are not positive.

    BUT if the translator does not want to allow such comments, it's their own right. I mean they provide hard work for us for free. They have their own reasons.

    I also have the right to drop the novel and say why. If they delete criticizing comments about the plot or style of the novel, it is another reason for me to drop it.

    I once read a popular novel and after not few chapter noticed how the author's writing there showed constantly strong nationalism and pictured other countries as hateful and/or inferior compared to the alternative worlds version of China. After a while I wrote about it in the comment section, but was never approved and I didn't see it posted even a whole afterwards. Maybe I forgot to actually post it, but I doubt it.
    Was I pissed of? Yes
    Did I drop the novel? Yes
     
    Last edited: Apr 25, 2020
  13. TheWanderingDragon

    TheWanderingDragon Member

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    Personally, criticism of the novel itself is fair game. I feel the translators or site hosts should feel free to remove extreme examples or derogatory slurs, but criticism alone should remain.

    Not everyoneeveryoneikes the same content and sometimes it's not until quite far in that a novel does something that particular people can't put up with.
     
  14. Kemm

    Kemm Custom title

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    The ones that just say "dropped" (or whatever short sentence to that effect) look to me more like an attempt to get attention than valid comments.

    I do have criticized some data and opinions given by authors, if I feel that whatever the author said is funny, offensive or may perpetuate ignorance about something, for example, but the few times I have made some mention to the writing style or the author's choice of plot building is either to address some theory or to express surprise about how something that shouldn't have worked (either for me or in general), did work.

    Bashing the author in a place where the comments won't reach is 1) bad (same as if done in a place where the author can notice) and 2) cowardice, not to mention self-entitlement. Comments saying how bad a certain series is are just plain stupid, and even more if the same commenter keeps making them as the story progreses onwards (why do they keep reading?); if you don't like a novel, no one is forcing you to read it. Finally comments of "this series is a drop because of xx" are quite cringy, since 1) no one needs to know why you dropped it unless they go to forum threads where that's the topic of discussion, or that you dropped it, in fact, 2) most of the time the reason for the drop was there from the start, so it makes no sense that it took you until chapter 300 for that to sink in, and 3) oftentimes the way those comments are worded indicate that the people who wrote them take their own opinions as absolute (i.e. they don't say "I don't like it, so I drop it", but "since I think this is bad, this is objectively bad").

    And let's not mention the Maurice Bartlett out there, who believe translators owe them.
    (Weird enough, someone with that name defended the completely opposite position at the site of succesor in translation of the translator in whose site the legend was born.)
     
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  15. Asf

    Asf 《《The aria of souls》》

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    A lot of the time the negative comments is just people illy informed or missleading at best so I dont bother too much with it
    The people reading here which is mostly teenagers have a very narrow likes and a very wide dislikes
    If a novel catch their interest at first but it turns out that it differs from their favorite genre, people will trash rate it in a metter of 15 chapters
    There are a late bloomer novel that only picks up at chapter 70 or more . And looking at the review section, theres tons of 1 star rating with 50 or less chapters redt and they act like theyve been NTRed by the author who also cheats them out of their bank account... acting like kids
     
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  16. jersanxx1

    jersanxx1 『Lost Toy』『Mostly Lurking』

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    Well, at least imo, everyone has a right at healthy debates so long as they're not outright spoiling, damaging another, trolling, or pure derision.

    When I saw people saying "This novel's shit, dropped" or anything close to that sh*te(sometimes, urging others) in either chapter comments or review section without any sort of constructive criticism, I'd just ignore it altogether.

    Some reader's entitlement these days are too damn high that it looks like translators owe them of some sort even though they're just fellow filthy leechers.

    I even saw someone derisively demanded a translator to change his translation style 'cuz it's too cringe for him(root cause: just because translator left "ara ara" untranslated), while calling the translator a weeb sh*te. Seriously?
     
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  17. Juju48

    Juju48 Well-Known Member

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    I find it amazing how any time we have freedom to express ourselves, how quickly most of us stick our feet in our mouths.
     
  18. kouk2002

    kouk2002 Well-Known Member

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    I think there are a lot of comments that should be welcomed by translators and authors alike.

    The most obvious are corrections. So long as you can point what is wrong and give a valid reason and hopefully the correction as well, these I think most would welcome.
    Sites like Webnovel make it hard to point out certain corrections, some are okay if your using the app, but others can be more effort than its worth.
    Like grammar or gender, in the end, the problems are that numerous and that hard to point to out that you only end up with people complaining every chapter about it.

    People discussing the events of the chapter both the good and bad parts. Simply putting its crap or whatever doesn't count. By bad I mean stuff like the characters made stupid mistakes or decisions. A new character shows up and leaves a bad impression. Sometimes the events of a chapter can be quite dark and you need to vent a little but you should still treat the author or translator with respect even then.

    I think comments that are just plain insulting should be banned. Same with repeated questions like for "harem?".
    Additionally comments that try force the author to change or add elements to the story. Sure the first time might be valid suggestions but I see a lot getting posted every chapter, even as a reader I think of it as harassment. These tend to be aimed more at authors than translators though you do sometimes see them. Usually stuff about honorifics and maybe change a term to better suit a reader's preference (like switching appraisal for identity or vise versa).

    It might come across as narrow-minded but you often see people reading an English translation or Original get comments in lots of different languages. I think you as the commenter should put the effort into translating it, be that with your own limited use of English or using google translate or something. It shouldn't be the author or translators' job to look up each comment especially when they are only going to use google translate. It's an even bigger pain when you consider some will only be using apps on their phones and will find it next to impossible to translate it.

    At the end of the day, I think any good comment system should allow a few basic things.
    First the ability to edit or delete your own comments.
    Quotes are helpful for pointing out errors or just places you particularly enjoyed.
    Ability to both rate up and down comments. It would be even better if comments rated down enough were auto-deleted.
     
  19. rhianirory

    rhianirory Well-Known Member

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    the entire reason we have a comment section is to comment and give an honest opinion of the story.
    sometimes that opinion will be negative. as long as it's not nasty, people have the right to express their opinions. negative comments have saved me from wasting my time (and that includes 'i dropped this because' comments where people explain why they are dropping) and I appreciate them because, when I've ignored those opinions and read anyways, I've ended up regretting it on more than one occasion. and some of those comments are pretty entertaining in and of themselves.
    on the flip side, sometimes those negative comments actually entice me to read something I had no plans on reading because they are complaining about a genre, trope, or character type that I like, even if they don't. it works both ways.
     
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  20. Zomula

    Zomula Well-Known Member

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    Although it is important to have free speech, the comments section is a translators domain and they are allowed to delete comments as they see fit. That said, I don't trust translators that do delete negative comments. That is one of the reasons that I avoid sites that do delete negative comments and reviews, and that doesn't apply only to novel sites but any other site as well.