Feature Request Fixing The Table Help Code

Discussion in 'Suggestions & Bug Reports' started by AliceShiki, May 4, 2018.

  1. AliceShiki

    AliceShiki 『Ms. Tree』『Aspect of Destruction』

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    This is a pretty minor thing, but I think it should be easy to fix, so I figure it would be nice to request... Can we have an actual helpful code tutorial on the help page when talking about tables? The current one we have is this:

    [TABLE][TR][TH]This is a header cell[/TH][TH]This is a header cell[/TH][/TR][TR1][TD]This is a left aligned cell[/TD][TD1]This is a centre aligned cell[/TD1][/TR1][TR2][TD2]This is a right aligned cell[/TD2][TD]Left aligned[/TD][/TR2][TR1][TD1]Centre aligned[/TD1][TD2]Right aligned[/TD2][/TR1][/TABLE]

    Not only it has a complete lack of organization, but most of it doesn't even make sense, as the codes for TH/TD/TD1/TD2 all do the same thing, just like the codes for TR/TR1/TR2 also do the same thing... Right now the tutorial we have is absolutely confusing and, while it does teach you how to make a table, you might lose a few dozen minutes figuring out how to make things work properly...

    Could the tutorial remove all the parts related to the multiple possible ways of making a row/cell that make no difference whatsoever and instead just give a simple template table with proper organization on the code, and that has at least 3 colums? Something like this:

    [TABLE][TR][TD]This is a Top Left Cell[/TD][TD]This is a Top Center Cell[/TD][TD]This is a Top Right Cell[/TD][/TR]
    [TR][TD]This is an Upper Left Cell[/TD][TD]This is an Upper Center Cell[/TD][TD]This is an Upper Right Cell[/TD][/TR]
    [TR][TD]This is a Left Cell[/TD][TD]This is a Center Cell[/TD][TD]This is a Right Cell[/TD][/TR]
    [TR][TD]This is a Lower Left Cell[/TD][TD]This is a Lower Center Cell[/TD][TD]This is a Lower Right Cell[/TD][/TR]
    [TR][TD]This is a Bottom Left Cell[/TD][TD]This is a Bottom Center Cell[/TD][TD]This is a Bottom Right Cell[/TD][/TR][/TABLE]

    Which would display as:

    This is a Top Left CellThis is a Top Center CellThis is a Top Right Cell
    This is an Upper Left CellThis is an Upper Center CellThis is an Upper Right Cell
    This is a Left CellThis is a Center CellThis is a Right Cell
    This is a Lower Left CellThis is a Lower Center CellThis is a Lower Right Cell
    This is a Bottom Left CellThis is a Bottom Center CellThis is a Bottom Right Cell
    I made it as 3x5 mainly to give make it obvious that the tables don't need to have the same amount of rows and columns. And with at least 3 rows because it shows more easily that you can make the table grow as much as you want...

    I kinda already learned how to use the tables, but it's generally a hassle for everyone that is starting to try to use them, because the tutorial really gives way too much pointless information that is honestly confusing (mainly because the codes for the cells all do the same thing, so the explanation text on each cell doesn't help in the slightest), so... It would be nice to have it use less commands that don't really make any difference in their usage, would make the learning process easier...

    Thanks in advance! ^^)/


    PS: The [CONTAINER][/CONTAINER] code also doesn't seem to do anything for as far as I have tested, so it would be nice to have it removed too... Unless there is some way to make it work that I never saw... I think there is none though. Nvm, just discovered its use. It makes tables work properly on mobile.
     
    Last edited: May 6, 2018
  2. MangoGuy

    MangoGuy Rambling Mango

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    I don't understand what is going on... But all I know is these tables seem to be useful to you. But, can I get a link to the tutorial?
    Nvm, I just noticed it.
     
  3. AliceShiki

    AliceShiki 『Ms. Tree』『Aspect of Destruction』

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    Yeah, take a look at the tutorial and try the codes out a bit, they are just... Absolutely useless, at least the ones related to the table... It's just sooo confusing! >.<

    On that note, the link to the tutorial is super hidden, it's on the bottom right of the screen, on the left of the home button, I clicked that thing mainly because I was curious on what it did, I had no idea it would redirect me to a help page... It would be nice if the link to the help was more visible.
     
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  4. Nom de Plume

    Nom de Plume [Shio’s Disciple] [True Villain] [Equip: Gunblade] Novel Updates Staff

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    Container is necessary for mobile. It won’t scroll / resize right without it. I did some sort of table explanation somewhere, but idk where.


    Found
    Code:
    [CENTER][table]
    [tr] [td] I [/td] [/tr]
    [tr] [td] can [/td] [td] make [/td] [/tr]
    [tr] [td] a [/td] [td] useless [/td] [td] staircase [/td] [/tr]
    [/table]
    [table]
    [tr] [td] I [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [/tr]
    [tr] [td] can [/td] [td] make [/td] [td] [/td] [/tr]
    [tr] [td] a [/td] [td] useless [/td] [td] staircase [/td] [/tr]
    [tr] [td] even [/td] [td] more [/td] [td] [/td] [/tr]
    [tr] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] useless [/td] [/tr]
    [/table][/CENTER]
     

    If you’d like I can make a NUF bbcode tutorial on Monday Alice.
     
    Last edited: May 5, 2018
  5. AliceShiki

    AliceShiki 『Ms. Tree』『Aspect of Destruction』

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    Oooooooooooh, so that is what the container is for~ :aww::aww::aww::aww::aww::aww::aww:

    Honestly, I have been thinking of making a BB code tutorial since ages ago, but my laziness has been defeating me every time whenever I think of how I would get on the colors part... >.>

    I'd love if you could make one Plume-chan!!! *hugs*


    What I really wanted with this thread was to have Tony-chan fix the help page for tables though, because it is honestly terrible... I think it might be something default that comes with xenforo?

    On another note, this is wrong... >.>
    • All tags must have spaces in between them.
    • td tags absolutely must not touch other tags, even User and URL tags you cannot see in the Rich Text Editor usually.
    I mean, look at the table I did on my post, they're touching a lot of stuff, the only thing they can't touch are the "@" because... Well, nothing can touch the "@", or they don't work.
     
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  6. Nom de Plume

    Nom de Plume [Shio’s Disciple] [True Villain] [Equip: Gunblade] Novel Updates Staff

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    It’s colors and stuff. I’m saying when td tag touches [-i][-/i] and other tags things freak out. It starts trying to autoclose the cells and starts creating artefacts at the end of the table. I discovered this making the tables for the contest unless it’s been fixed since (which I doubt). A lot of crazy stuff starts happening, like the double spoiler tag but with tables. :blobfearful:

    It looks like... this after lines of code as well as after the table. Lots of repeating inserted code after tags which makes it a pain to fix.

    Code:
    [tr][td][user=308]nom[/user] is [i]silly![/i][/td][/tr][i][/i][/td][/tr]
    
    I typed that example out so it’s just to give you an idea. That last stuff after the tr just... appears :hmm:
     
  7. Nom de Plume

    Nom de Plume [Shio’s Disciple] [True Villain] [Equip: Gunblade] Novel Updates Staff

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    This is a test





    This is a Top Left Aligned CellThis is a Top Center Aligned CellThis is a Top Right Aligned Cell

    This is an Upper Left Aligned Cell

    This is an Upper Center Aligned Cell
    This is an Upper Right Aligned Cell
    This is a Left Aligned Cell
    This is a Center Aligned Cell​
    This is a Right Aligned Cell
    This is a Lower Left Aligned CellThis is a Lower Center Aligned CellThis is a Lower Right Aligned Cell
    This is a Bottom Left Aligned CellThis is a Bottom Center Aligned CellThis is a Bottom Right Aligned Cell
    55623ED0-0511-4661-B3BC-CF2AE775849A.jpeg 88CFAC98-E03B-4FDD-A0CA-FD344542AA3A.jpeg
    Let’s see if it works.
     
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  8. Nom de Plume

    Nom de Plume [Shio’s Disciple] [True Villain] [Equip: Gunblade] Novel Updates Staff

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    Hmmm... no randomly changing code which is good. The only thing that happened was the spacing.

    9BB932FA-D5C4-4652-AC1C-CBC99DFB23D3.jpeg

    This is what “appeared” for me in the past. I tried using the tr1 and tr2 which I later stopped using, but that had no effect on the weirdness.

    842FE833-029C-4319-A220-42C00B4960B2.png
    Full file
     
    Last edited: May 5, 2018
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  9. AliceShiki

    AliceShiki 『Ms. Tree』『Aspect of Destruction』

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    Ah, I know what happened on both cases. Well, more or less for the second one.

    For the big spacing at the top, the fault goes at the excessive spacing in the middle of the table, as in...

    [/TD]
    [TD]

    This kind of thing adds extra space to the top of the table usually.

    [TR][TD]This is a Left Aligned Cell[/TD][TD]
    [CENTER]This is a Center Aligned Cell[/CENTER]
    [/TD][TD]This is a Right Aligned Cell[/TD][/TR]

    Putting [ CENTER ] in the middle of the table works, but if you try to edit the post at any point, it becomes a bit messy, which leads to extra space on the top of the table... It generally doesn't go any further than that though.



    The absolute mess you showed on your second post usually comes when you change the font of anything and then tries to edit it, changing font is the biggest NUF I have ever seen on NUF, it works perfectly at first, but when you try to edit the post later (or if you change between rich text and bb code editor), it bugs all sorts of other codes on the same post for no reason in particular, it's maddening.

    I have also seen it happen if you mess excessively with colors, but it seems to need a LOT of messing up with, since I only saw it happen once. Font changes on the other hand can cause trouble really easily.

    ... I never had a problem with the table messing other things though... *goes check contest's table*

    Maybe it was because of excessive amount of codes in a single post? It would be similar to how it bugged for me once when I used an excessive amount of colors... Hard to be sure on the cause...

    Glad to see that the test worked properly this time at least! ^^)/
     
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  10. Ddraig

    Ddraig Frostfire Dragon|Retired lurker|FFF|Loved by RNG

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    I never noticed that button....
     
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  11. AliceShiki

    AliceShiki 『Ms. Tree』『Aspect of Destruction』

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    Because it is very very well hidden, and it doesn't look like a help button at all... I would have never clicked it if I didn't end up wondering what in the world was that button.
     
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  12. runsing

    runsing status : bleeding, health -10/s Novel Updates Staff

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    @Nom de Plume try removing the space between this is a test and table

    Code:
    this is a test[table]
    . i seem to remember @Westeller saying something like that
     
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  13. Westeller

    Westeller [Maid] [Cat boy] [Girly] [Watchu Looking at?] Staff Member

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    You mean this?
    https://forum.novelupdates.com/threads/how-do-you-make-a-table.52861/page-2#post-3400199

    That was about spacing after the initial Table tag. Spacing within the tags affects the table. If you want the table to look pretty, the code has to look ugly. That’s all.

    Anyway, +1 to the suggested change. ... But maybe change the cell text a bit. ‘X Aligned’ is a bit misleading. No alignment is used. This is just about rows and columns.

    The original example’s TR/1/2 and TD/1/2 are supposed to align text within the cells, and that’s why they’re used in the example with cell text explaining the alignment. If we’re removing them for simplicity and clarity, the text needs to change, too.
     
  14. AliceShiki

    AliceShiki 『Ms. Tree』『Aspect of Destruction』

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    Good point! >.<

    I'll make some edits to it later! ^^)/
     
  15. Nom de Plume

    Nom de Plume [Shio’s Disciple] [True Villain] [Equip: Gunblade] Novel Updates Staff

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    As I said lol.

    Excessive testing found that for the colors and other bugging tags to work, they had to not touch. Without the space in between it was counting the ending tags as a single tag, or at least seemed to. I still stand by my statements lol. At least it seems like it’s not necessary with simple tables.

    Haha. Well, I was typing in stuff that bugged for me in the past.

    I already know what caused it and the solution as stated in my first post, but thanks! The test was attempting to see if bugs I experienced when I first wrote those suggestions a year ago were still happening. As you see, the space thing always shall.

    Lol that confused me too until I realized she meant the cell was right aligned, but not the contents within the cell. (+1 to changing wording)
     
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  16. AliceShiki

    AliceShiki 『Ms. Tree』『Aspect of Destruction』

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    *still couldn't think of a better wording*

    Maybe just removing the "Aligned" would work? *edits it*

    Sounds somewhat weird... I wanted something that was easy to identify on the code and then see on the table at a single glance, but right now it seems somewhat ugly... *troubled*
     
  17. Nom de Plume

    Nom de Plume [Shio’s Disciple] [True Villain] [Equip: Gunblade] Novel Updates Staff

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    Looks good
     
  18. noisypixy

    noisypixy Sacatunn que pen, que summum que tun.

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    Counter-suggestion: Getting rid of closing tags. Similar to what's currently being done on lists.
    Code:
    [table]
    [col] Top left
    [col] Top middle
    [col] Top right
    
    [row]
    
    [col] Middle left
    [col] Center
    [col] Middle right
    
    [row]
    
    [col] Bottom left
    [col] Bottom middle
    [col] Bottom right
    [/table]
    
    Code:
    [table]
    [col] Top left
    
    [row]
    
    [col] Middle left
    [col] Center
    
    [row]
    
    [col] Bottom left
    [col] Bottom middle
    [col] Bottom right
    [/table]
    
    I believe all the context needed is already provided by the [table][/table] tags.
     
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  19. AliceShiki

    AliceShiki 『Ms. Tree』『Aspect of Destruction』

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    I would love something like that, but this would require changing NUF's code, which @Tony pretty much never does unless she is either in need of a change of pace from her actual work, or is feeling plain bored, so... I don't think it is feasible.

    Hence why I asked something simple like changing the text on the help page, because asking any feature for NUF is almost guaranteed to be a lost cause.

    I do like the idea though~