Discussion James bond is going the way of the dodo, ladies, what do you think?

In terms of race-bending or gender-bending, a comedy like "White Chicks" is fair game. Now, were it about 2 White guys cross-dressing as Black women, not sure how that could happen without Blackface being used.

 

I only watched some of the old ones as a kid on free-to-air tv, along with things like Mr Ed and Dr Who. So I barely remember it at all, and as for the remake (that according to imdb was made in 2007?) I can't say I ever watched it so I don't have an opinion. Are you recommending it or just asking?

Now that I think about it, maybe it's confirmation bias but I don't think the west really does female protagonists very well outside of dramas (which I refuse to admit I watch... cough cough). It's just a mash of effortless nonsense that gets popular while the more enjoyable, character driven shows like SCC get left behind in the wastelands of infomercial tier ratings.

 

I am referring to the 2007 version that I wanted to watch but it got cancelled too.

I think Asian dramas have better female leads because their society is a lot more patriarchal.
Jobs like scriptwriting for TV is usually done by women.
And one scriptwriter does an entire TV series.
It can be a duo like the sister writing duo called Hong Sisters.
After a few hits, they get popular and their unique female characters are not changed by a sexist male producer
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hong_sisters

Most badass female lead but low on romance:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hotel_del_Luna

Best overall story:


https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/My_Girlfriend_Is_a_Nine-Tailed_Fox

 

While I don't doubt that anime/manga does have their own versions of SJWs story wise at times, it is my experience they are not as guilty about it as American media.

 

The issue is that characters are usually not consistent.

Shows last too long. Writing staff, showrunners and others get changed.

It is no longer about telling a story but following the latest trend.

I did watch a Japanese drama that spent majority of the drama on a side character that was gay than the main lead couple.

People jump on bandwagons but since the show was like 10 episodes or less. Even an excess of something did not feel so bad.

You could also accuse Western TV of overcompensating since it is easier to expose people like Western Weinstein and the TV companies who were affected are trying to get back into the good graces of female audiences.

I am sure females want a female superhero but majority didn't want a lesbian one like in Batwoman.

It denies audience the opportunity of seeing gender roles reversed where the female is actually physically stronger than her male love interest.

Even Supergirl turned Jim Olsen to a body builder.
It is just dumb

 

Well, I am imagine some women want a lesbian/bisexual super heroine but one doesn't emphasize her sexuality as her defining point.

 

The key here is some but most women are not lesbian. It is trying to force feed on the audience.

You can have a side character that is lesbian. It works just as well. You promote the side character to a main one if reception is good.

It is like changing Doctor Who to female.
If you were writing the best female Doctor then people won't mind.
It is usually just a gimmick or half assed and comes off as patronizing.

I think people forget that storytelling is not protesting. You are supposed to put your audience first especially for TV.

One episode about LGBTQI I can stomach but when it is every episode it is annoying.

We consume fiction like superhero fiction to escape reality. No need to force reality on us

I recall the TV series called Girls. Where the female lead was always nude. The actress playing her was also the producer. She is overweight and it seemed more like she was trying to make a statement or prove something than telling a story. And no she was not nude for sex scenes. Just nude to be nude like the set was a nudist beach

 

There is a Black AnCap (Anarcho-Capitalist) Libertarian on YT named YungRppa59. He is a comic book collector/reader and regularly does videos speaking out against tokenizing characters. The following is 1 of his videos that he uploaded just under 7 months ago:.
However, he practices what he preaches and there is 1 video I know of where he was reviewing a comic book with original Asian characters and which one he thought has/had a chance of being a successful character.

Now Wonder Woman being bisexual I don't see as being an SJW thing. Growing up in an all-women village and the close relationships she had with various women were valid hints. Of course, just because 2 members of the same sex/gender have a close relationship that doesn't mean they are necessarily lovers. The line between a familial/close friendship type of love and romantic love can be blurred at times.

 

I get that tokenizing is an issue but if you turn every male superhero to female then you will need to use dude-in-distress trope.
It fails horribly because people are not used to writing such tropes.

This then leads to turning all female superheroes to lesbians in order to keep damsel in distress trope.
Then we have the same issue of lack of representation of genders. There is no room for positive male characters as the only room left will be for male villains

 

This is why it helps, at least in this current era, to have an new, non-tokenized character to be established as a certain gender, race, or sexuality from the start. Of course, even if you have an original character that is Black transman established like that from the start, primarily focusing on such things vs. the story line can be lazy writing. Now how much leeway there is to inject such identity politics or political agenda into an original story with original characters is debatable. However, something like making an AU version of Clark Kent a Black transman is not O.K.

This particular thread is what inspired me to create now-locked yet recent thread: forum.novelupdates.com/threads/when-an-sjw-actress-on-twitter-blocks-me-for-criticizing-them-for-see-inside.115496.

 

I personally do not find much issue with Alternate Universe Superman being black, gay or trans or whatever.
These people should not be surprised when it flops.

A minority is a minority for a reason.. There is a reason critically acclaimed movies usually flop at the box office.

You cannot force people to like what you like.

The issue is that people judge others for having different tastes.

I get why the thread got locked.
I can easily locate a post by a misogynist too

It is not good discourse. It is picking and choosing to fit your narrative

 

Well, if I was running DC and headed AT&T, I would start firing as many people who SJW established characters, including AU versions.

Also, if people are fine with Blackwashing, then Whitewashing is also fair game. Yes, Whitewashing has a longer and uglier history but fighting racism with more racism (Blackwashing) is not the way to do it. SJWs often lack common sense in such departments.

 

i dont understand why black washing gets the pass, but the corporates know better ig

 

Yes, if I saw a White person auditioning for a Black role in a live-action film or vice versa, I would say "Yes, you are being fired because your are wrong race to play that character. Now were this for a voice acting role, there is more leeway there!"

 

I honestly don't care.

I only watched Pierce Brosnan's 007 and have no interest in the other actors' versions as they're not aesthetically pleasing to me. But I watched those movies when I was still interested in watching movies. Nowadays, I find myself more and more bored of the scenarios I see, so I barely watch a few movies a year (none yet for 2020). I'd love to support female-lead movies for the heck of it, like Captain Marvel, Birds of Prey, upcoming Wonder Woman, this new 007, Ocean's female cast, Ghostbusters female cast. I really don't give a shit if they're previous franchises and they just switched the men for women and it's blasphemy or whatever. What bothers me is I can't force myself to watch something I know would bore me story-wise. I watch the trailers and click away.

I actually followed the hype and watched Wonder Woman, but as someone who understands nothing about cinematography, I only care about the story and the visuals/actors/music are just either good or bad. And I was bored... I can remember the last three movies I watched that I actually liked - Predestination, John Wick, and The Accountant. The thing is, I do want female leads, but I'm also picky about the story. I'm not into the usual drama they produce for female actresses. I have to resort to re-watching Alien every few years. I'm kinda expecting A Promising Young Woman, but if it turns into a drama instead of a slasher-flick, I'll flip tables. Oh, and I'm curious about Jordan Peele's movies, they look very intriguing. But I've seen so many spoilers already that I can only make myself watch them if I have company. Which in these Covid times...haha.

 

Is it really about a strong, independent woman if the film is based on men's firm foundation already?

 

hmmm you lost me when put john wick with story.... imo john wick is action pack with almost minimum story, story wise the matrix is better or terminator if we talking about action yes john wick is sick on good sense

 

I'm very into revenge stories. It doesn't have to be something wild. I also liked the strangeness of their world, so it kept my interest more than just the action. I gotta say I love older action movies like Rambo, Predator, Terminator, The Matrix. They do have intriguing stories to follow. In John Wick's case, it was simply who's dying next and them running around to protect the target lol. Considering I love slasher flicks and horrors, it's enough to get me invested. The subtleties of film making are lost on me, but I can really appreciate the final result. Maybe the one thing that jumped out at me is how they synched the music to the action rhythm. It really was a stylish movie.

Perhaps I'm using the word story too loosely. I have no idea how it's perceived by a native speaker. To me it's like the scenario - what's going on in the movie. So I'm not really looking for something rich and intricate like Lord of the Rings. It can be something like Final Destination - people escape death then start dying one by one in a gruesome manner and try to survive - it's enough to intrigue me because it sounds a lot more interesting to me than three women at work team up to sue their boss for sexual harassment. It's just my taste.

 

When I do rants on such SJWing on Twitter, I often link to a tweet thread that has me admitting to being a hypocrite in that I might not have read the source material(s). Helps to put a disclaimer like that.

Now while I oppose to such SJW changes, I am fine with race-bending via voice acting or cosplaying. You know, like a Black person voice acting a non-Black character. An example of this: A Black guy voice acting a White cishet Clark Kent or cosplaying as Superman is fine! A Black Clark Kent in a cartoon, comic book, movie, or TV show is not O.K.

 

James Bond is for 80's and 90's, no point in making these shitty new movies.