LCD Tales of Demons and God

Respected as a whole? That's a bad choice of words. I used those word in contrast/opossition to what you adhere: you affirm that a person, if he's a genius (for example) has the right to bend the law, right? No, I don't know that person's life but I know that I can't agree with his way of doing things, for example, isn't his biggest wish to ,,win" the daughter and defend the city? Then, can't he abstain/refrain from being at fault with her father? So, if If you want to win the daughter you must be rude to the father?

Fact of life? I've quoted what respect means, right? Well, I can't have a feeling of ,,appreciative, often deferential regard; esteem" for him as a person, only for his cultivation/power/knowledge. I can respect him for the effort, but not for how he treats the elders.

Face has something to do with what that title means. For example, if a CEO of a company says something wrong then that company is at fault.

,,yet practically everyone else is the same as Nie Li", I discuss Nie Lie because I don't know the others, right? Isn't respect for your elders a general value in our society? What do you respect: age or mind? In case of elders, if they don't have mind, then you respect their age, no? We can discuss this fact at least from two point of view: 1. a general point of view, where the majority gives substance to the notion; 2. a particular point of view where the ,,victim" of the lack of respect feels it, if she/he is feels affected by it. I've tried to discuss the first one.

,,shitty manbabies that do battle if you don't give them "face"" in a society that value face, if he don't give them face then he doesn't want face, right? But ,,face" represents a social rule of that society, right? For me, he's too aggresive, but that's the plot. Doesn't Nie Li uses the fact that the adoptive son of the Lord isn't in the position to make observations/to incite/to criticize? Then, doesn't that mean that that son doesn't give face to the Lord? Then, is Nie Li outside of society or in society? Does he points that lack of respect for the lord because he points out the futility of ,,face"? No, from my point of view, he uses those rules only when he thinks that he has something to gain from them. So, if the rules aren't for everyone, doesn't that invite corruption?

,,Like I said, NO ONE should give face to those old fools who did not stop the destruction of the city the first time around" -​

He jugdes the ones from the future. Do you want to say that you are to be jugded for a hypothetical mistake ? But, I repeat the story doesn't allow us to discuss it. I don't think that we have enought criterias to do so.

Ok, then he began to change the future. If he began to change the future, does that mean that he still were to kill all the Sacred family for something that will happen in the future?

,,Tell me, why should your average people who only know Nie Li and Ye Zong by rumours should give face to either of them? Because one is the head of a family? He has a grey beard and he's old? Fuck that."​

Respect, in a way, is a mean to avoid conflict. If someone were to show a ,,lack" of face to one of his friends what will he do? I can't know, it wasn't showed in the novel. If we were to use the same values, then, even NIe Li were to receive face. Oh, maybe ,,face" isn't for everyone, only for those with power? Then, if only those who have power deserve it then, Nie Li, who doesn't have power shows a lack of respect, doesn't he deserve retribution of a kind if those with power decide to?

,,People are exempt or have reduce sanctions when they have useful, if you haven't figured this out mr. saint then I don't know what to say. You can disagree with this but that's how the world spins." Really? That's true, but, they aren't always exempt from it. If a person with power or who won the Nobel Prize were to kill a kid or to rape a kid is he exempted from it? Tell me. In my opinion, no.

Yes, I blame him ethically and I'm not sure why. I've wrote in my previous post that we discuss about fiction. You can say that I'm twisted, but I've tried to explain what I see wrong with that set of values that the novel has. If the sistem of the novel allow killing, ok. But, if the sistem says that face is a values, then what? Why doesn't he respect that value? The novel only summarize some values, we, as peoples/humans develop them using what we know. So, if the novel doesn't define what ,,face" means, then I try to give a notion. How do I do that? With my twisted sense of values.

,,You seem to dislike that he's not this sefless benelovent person that does not do any wrong. Well tell me, what have YOU done. Have you donated your fortune to charity, are you constantly working for free and doing volunteer work." All of this began from a previous post: ,,Nie Li doing work this chapter, publicly being direspectful towards the Sacred Family whcih will infuriate them even more, hasty actions makes for possible slip-ups". That was what I criticized. What have I done in my life? What does that have to do with this story? We discuss morals or not? Why do I have to donate all my fortune to charity? Does that mean that if someone has a fortune is a bad person? Why should I work for free all my time? I've just tried to show that he does care only for those that are close to him or those that can help him. That's what I think he does.

,,Can you cast the first stone? Do you dare?" Dare what? Why should I try to throw a stone? To whom? why? Nie Li's a fictional character, no?

,,I say I've seen enough Xianxia turn out to be evil with way less foreshadowing and information. If you need to see a scene where we see the sacred family puttin babies in a cauldron for a spell to convince you, well so be it. Maybe it will really happen."​

And if it were Nie Li to do those things, after he saved that city, is he exempted from sanctions?

,,So you are agreeing with me?" I've wrote, usually. If you have money you give them to win time but it doesn't mean that you'll win time for certain. Also, that doesn't mean that you'll have money all the time. Also, that doesn't mean that you'll make more money in the time that you've won and you'll compesate the money that you've gave. A definition of the idiom that you seem to use: http://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/time-is-money or this particular one: http://financial-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/Time+value+of+money .

,,And no, you're looking down on young people here. I"ve met countless teenagers or young people that were ten times more worthy than some old man "respected by all". This ageism pure and simple. The fact thst you say "you can't expect X" to be able to means you're generalizing everyone of that age bracket, shame on you."
​

I've wrote this: ,,and no, I don't try to win arguments, I try to understand them. If I don't have time, I act how I see fit at that moment. To debate with a child means to use the same words as a child even if your mental age is bigger than his or her but that's it, only you can go down on the steps of age, you can't expect that a children has the power, will and capacity to understand everything you have to say or why you do that, no sir! So that's why you use your authority. There are other aspect that you have to consider when you discuss/debate/analyze something. And so on."

No, I don't look down on young people but I don't think that all youg people can or should be treated as adults. I talk with them but I don't expect a children of 13 to act like an adult. Why I don't expect? Because, maybe, they can only discuss with you only that aspect. Then, if he/she is fit for the role that you want to give him/her in your company, for example, then I don't see what's wrong with that, if he pass the interview or meet the criterias, right? Why you shoudn't treat all the time the childrens like adults? For exemple, because a children of 12 years old can't do the physical work of an adult. Or, from a medical point of view, even if a children of, let's say, 5 years old understands all the aspects of what sex does imply that doesn't mean that her body can't tolerate that foreign body in his- the cases of girls.

I think that we should stop here. If you want to discuss more, let's go in private.

 

Heavy reading. I think it's nice to see a lengthy debate though regardless of the outcome in contrast to some of the other stuff (& derailment) flying around in most of these threads.

I think Nie Li has simply reached the conclusion that he's approaching the point of being essentially untouchable. His 'show' at the banquet is to let everyone know that he can pretty much do whatever he wants and Ye Zong isn't going to reprimand him. Even if his fighting strength isn't as high yet, he is still one of the most powerful people in the city, as he is indispensable to both the alchemist association and the city lord's mansion, not to mention how wealthy he is.

Yes, maybe baiting Ye Han is slightly premature, but there isn't many times where so many people are going to be present. Maybe it's precisely because Nie Li doesn't properly know how to deal with him that he's decided it's probably just easiest to crush him instead. Considering Ye Ziyun and the whole succession fiasco, I think it's impossible for Ye Han/Nie Li to ever be friends. As for baiting the Sacred family, it's a chance to reduce their strength. Openly offending them is a clear message to everyone present at the banquet that Nie Li has no problem going up against a whole family if they go against him, and as a result other families may continue to pull away from the Sacred family.

 

This is my first time in this thread. All I really wanted was some super basic speculation on romance and to +1 Xiao Ning’er for best waifu. I land here on page 5 and the first thing I see is this massive wall of text...

I don't think it's really fitting to pull out philosophy and discuss the virtue of these people and their actions without appropriately assessing it within their own social context. A while ago I was on quora reading this: https://www.quora.com/China/Are-the-Chinese-ashamed-of-copying-American-technology-and-designs
and one of the answers I found really fitting was this:

It's short so just open it.

I remember experiencing it, coming from reading the way more laid back, super peaceful Japanese light novels to Chinese ones. I remember being a bit shocked at the asshole-courting-death encounter rate and lots of other stuff I couldn't really agree with, and still don't understand. You just have to realize that the culture, and thus the context for their actions and behavior, is different and either enjoy the ride or stop reading if you can't.

That said, I think Nie Li's a pretty good guy. Sure, his romance prospects are considerably younger than him, so I can see how this is morally questionable. The topic of maturity, consent, and propriety are debates on their own, but as I see it, the girls aren't being exploited or otherwise pressured and can make their own decisions. Other than this point, nothing he's done really bothers me. At the moment, of all the Chinese protagonists I'm following, Nie Li's probably one of the more mild ones.

 

Do you think that anything besides him ending up with Ye Ziyun is possible with the rest just hanging on? I think the only thing to speculate on is how long Ye Ziyun is going to keep the leash, what will she let him get away with?

Choice.

 

Does "Choice" signify agreement?

Xiao Ning'er fled into monster infested mountains to escape her fate. She embodies willfulness and determination which means that her love will not lose D:<. Honestly, I see a harem end, but I'm fine with this. Ye Ziyun also is heroic and noble spirit when it comes down to it so I think she's alright.

What I'm really curious about is how Huyan Lanruo fits into it. Flags all say she's game with the harem route, but Nie Li doesn't seem to have any positive impression at all right now...

 

@cdlevit

Why should Nie Li respect those experts who are only older than him physically. In terms of both knowledge and experience he does actually have more than probably several of them combined. In that regard the only person who possibly comes close to him that we have met so far is the ancestor Ye Yan. So I really need to ask what elders does he have that he is disrespecting.

I am more respectful of the elderly because they have more experience than me but if they didn't and insisted they were right or that they deserved or were entitled to my respect just because they were older than me physically I can't guarantee that I wouldn't go all Nie Li on them. Age is basically an arbitrary number that at best ensures a level of physical maturity. Mental and emotional maturity come from a persons experiences, and while an older person is likely to have more it isn't a guaranteed thing even for us in the real world.

To be honest, I do think Nie Li goes over the line with the stuff he does, but at the same time I feel like most of what he has done can be inferred to be because he knows Ye Ziyun's feelings on the matter. It's actually one of the most frustrating things about TDG for me. All the pieces are there for something amazing but while I can't put it in words something has gone terribly wrong in the execution of it.

 

Ah sorry, yeah it does.

Maybe she'll be like how Nie Li is currently to Ye Ziyun, upfront and active in pursuit. I'm mainly interested in how far Nie Li would be willing to go with people aside from Ye Ziyun. The girls are surely going to gather around him, and I'm sure there will be development with Ye Ziyun, but who knows if he's interested in developing further with others, and if Ye Ziyun will agree to it

 

Personally I hope Ye Ziyun and Nie Li don't end up together and that she lives. I want it to happen so that it's not that he can't be with her just that he doesn't end up with her. She's being pushed as the main heroine so hard that I just want him to end up with someone else because it would betray my current expectations. I also really don't want the Harem route. Imagine how shocking it would be if the only girl he ended with was Huyan Lanrou and we got see the two slowly progressing from their current situation to actually being a couple. Unfortunately, the flags are all wrong for anything interesting to happen.

 

I've been shipping Xiao Ning'er but Huyan Lanrou would actually be amazing after reading about her temper. The two of them could go around stirring up trouble everywhere. Wait wasn't that Chu Feng and Zi Ling

 

Xiao Ning'er clearly gets a pass since she was Ye Ziyun's childhood friend. That's why Huyan Lanrou's situation feels a bit ambiguous.

Didn't draw the connection to Chu Feng till you pointed it out. Nice.

 

@ sal880612m - Sorry, I won't give you a long answer. You are right in what you've wrote. I've tried to show that there are at least two meanings of the word respect and those meaning are made by people for people and I've gone to far. Won't write more on that subject.

@mockmountain - that guy says something like what Carl Levi Strauss wrote in one of his books: when you travel you travel in space, time and society and I see nothing wrong with those opinions.

 

Haha, all that misunderstanding.

 

Ye Han is about to make a fool of himself in front of everyone

 

I just find his timing of coming back really suspicious. I'm sure Nie Li's actions with the Dark Guild/Sacred Family made his surface again otherwise where was he when Glory City was attacked? Where was he when the survivors left Glory City? This guy is a snitch and will die a snitches death.

 

Oh i have a feeling he is also a Spy of the Dark Guild
Remember that elder that left with Ye Han? i have a feeling that Ye Han got rid of him via Dark Guild and its pretending that the Elder found some ruins and what not

 

He will soon reveal his true colours after Nie Li whips his ass.

 

I still think he's a beast not a Dark Guild. Inviting a Demon Beast in, letting him go around unchallenged and come to understand the defenses of Glory City, that would be the shame of the Snow Wind family.

 

He's not a spy lol. but He will soon be one. because he lost to Nie LI.

 

This is pretty much whats happening