\ You know what? Fine, agree to disagree. I've said my part and I feel like I've articulated my point well. You have your own view and honestly that's fine. I appreciate how polite you've been with me this whole time as heated as I got. You're way more civil than other people I've discussed this with and I honestly have to appreciate that.
One more thing: I honestly hope you don't expect anyone to take you seriously when you can't even properly define what plot armor is.
Alright everyone, it is my turn to get it out of my chest. I will feel better. The harsh truth is that this novel is a copy of a chinese's novel, full of the same paterns and cliché. Even the white lotus girl, aka Ji-eun. Seriously, you should go read all the characters's POV, it is really instructing. For exemple, guess how Ruve was in the firt's timeline? Yes, exacly like Tia, haughty and cold. He DID look down on Ji-eun the way Tia did, thinking she has no grace and dignity. So how dare he use that excuse to hate on her? And everyone agree that he is cold-hearted in the second timeline for a reason (Keiran clearly said that he don't like him and hope that Tia would choose someone else, even if he intend to respect her choice). It is a bad case of "defrosting the ice-king" plot with the other main leads being waaay better, even psycho Allen. Same thing for Ji-eun. Do you believe for a second that a "good girl" would feel inferiority complex toward the woman who lost everything because of her? She is just as arrogant and vain than the others, refusing to take responsibilty for taking the throne when she didn't even know how to freaking WRITE. Yes, she was a teenager, but not a child. She should have know better. I feel more pity toward all the poor citizens who deserved to have a good ruler. If the author intended to make Tia go back to Ruve, a "bitter sweet ending" would have suited the story better, like not doing it because she love him but because there would be no one else to think of the people. A noble sacrifice. Not a "love can make you forgive anything" story. Less and less readers are falling for it nowadays. As for for the poisoning, he has burst of anger but was still rational. A lot of his actions were volontary. When he take a sword to hurt a servant in anger, it is because of the drug; When he target specificaly someone, it is volontary. He admit it himself at the end, he won't make excuses for what he did because there is none. He let the darkest part of him, like his pride and jalousy, get the better of him. He refused to listen to good advisers (his own political party, no less) because they hurted his pride as a child, not because he was drugged for exemple. He want the throne, but refuse to take responsibilty for it. When you are in charge, you don't get to choose whoever you like as your partner. He or she need to be able to work too. If he was a good ruler, Tia would have been Empress and Ji-eun a concubine in the first timeline. This is how it is supposed to work. One doesn't know how to write when the other one was prepared for the task since birth. Also, the destruction of a family that is binded by a freaking blood oath and called the more loyal followers of the Imperial family shoud be a red warning that you are doing something wrong. The "poison" plot does not work because it was cleary up to a point disciminating against Tia. If not, his fist of anger toward the servants and nobles would have been the number one topic talked about when she was still alive. As for the second timeline goes, maybe all that happened in the first timeline should not be hold against him. But it did happen. As a human being, Tia should have been unwilling to go back to him, no matter how much he has changed and love her. Humans are never this benevolent. You remember me of someone I used to know that hurted me very much? Sorry, I will do my very best to stay polite but I will feel incomfortable next to you and will try to avoid you from now on. Don't take it too personnally, this is just how it is. Also the "sweet moments" would have been creepy if by the author's will she wasn't in love with him from the beggining. I would never advise anyone to date someone who forcebly kissed them or took the risk to create horrible rumors. Yes, I am talking about the "sweet" momemt they shared the night she cheered him up after the Empeor's death. For nobility, dignity come before all. So, mind to explain why he took her to his personnal room and stayed with her all night when there was empty rooms in the castle? Taking the risk to make eveyone think that she is his mistress?
There are quite a lot of problem with the basic plot and characters set-up and development. What the is the difference in the 2-nd timeline that make the Crown prince (CP) a “wise ruler”, while he is basically a f*ck-up douchebag (well, more like loser) in the 1-st timeline. In the 1-st timeline, he trust the Duke Jena – the head of the noble fraction like a fool (and then casted away Duke Lars and Verita of the pro-emperor fraction). After a few years of work he ended up alone with no one to trust. Doesn’t that mean he is quite stupid? (How can an intelligent prince, who read so much, work so much with a father guidance end up like that? – the poison does mess up his temper and emotion, but not his rational thinking ability). Then, miraculously, that same stupid, narrow-mind dude become a wise, clever, decisive ruler in the 2-nd timeline. Because of what? Because he stopped envying Aristia? What a joke. Second, what made Aristia love the CP in the 1st timeline? How can a clever, perfect, emotional girl (as everyone said) love a stupid dude who hated her???? Has he ever done something for her to make her love him that much? Yeah I understand that she has lived her whole life as his fiancé, but doesn't real love requires a real interaction? At least a smile, a favor or something of the sort. Third, it doesn’t make sense to me that her father didn’t save her life, as well as meet her before, or even during her execution. And many many more strange thing that don’t make any sense but to make the story more dramatic, more pathetic for Aristia in the 1-st timeline. Aristia: despite her vow that she won’t love the CP and that she will inherit the family and all, the whole story is about her getting scared, getting upset, going back and forth between loving him or not, be with him or not, and other... Also, she can easily forget her friends. Why do I say so? She basically forgets about Allendis and Carssein when they don’t come to her =)))). Doesn’t that kind of made her a b*tch LOL. Aristia’s dad: he loved his wife enough to ignore his family legacy, but was super calm knowing Aristia was poisoned LOL. He loves his daughter the most, he wants her to do the thing she wants, but didn’t try to break off the engagement when she said so (I can’t see his action as trying, especially after the old emperor died), also she said she wants to inherit the family, but he doesn’t want her to do so. The plot regarding all the poison and Duke Jena is disappointing. The novel made a fuss about all the investigation, the counterattack from Aristia and all, but they are all so flop. Many anticipate some surprises, maybe there’s some secret with the poison, maybe someone else close to Aristia and CP were the one behind all the problem. No, it is the villain Duke Jena, just like how the story indicates from the beginning that Duke Jena is the bad guy. lmao (ctto Vita95) So you can stop your sophistry now. PEOPLE RECOVER FROM TRAUMA BUT NOT TO THE ONE WHO TRIGGERS IT. THAT'S SIMPLE LOGIC. GET IT THRU YOUR BLIND FAN FOLLOWING.
Really? Then you should see for yourself now. There are already comprehensive reviews on the novel and them reading it despite how awful the plot holes are and story elements that are poorly executed. Your reasons seem tantamount to excuses as well. Having a support network is not equal to the effect of having a therapist. Since its not a modern setting, its safe to say that the people there are ignorant on mental illnesses and can't exactly empathize with her. Lastly, popular in Korea? lol don't be a jest (give us the link then). The only news I heard there is the author being bashed by her disturbing ending.
I liked this mawha simply for the gut clenching agony that the characters go through. Call me a bit of a sadist, but I like it when the characters are tortured a bit. I'm reading a similar Korean novel right now, called "I Don't Wish to Be Loved". The premise is the same, Girl suffers through her marriage miscarries and dies only to be reborn again as a child. She then completely changes her future to try to avoid everything happening again. Unbeknownst her, her husband also reincarnated though and determined to have her back and treat her better this time. I don't know how I feel about him though, He treated her terribly without even having any of the excuses, like being drugged. But I am enjoying the agony
Have you read the full novel of I don't want to be loved or read the spoilers? I like it a lot because it was very well executed and interesting. Igor is a great ML and contrary to Abandonned Empress there is a lot of believable plot twist that will make readers accept him in the end. Contrary to blueberry, he had nothing to do with most of the FL misfortunes. I don't intend to overlook what he did do, but he definitly made amend for it (and it was often shared responsibility). He didn't make excuses , took responsibility and fought very hard to make it right.
Ok ok so this continued debate about whether this is a Bad Story or not is very interesting but I have a quick question. Do we ever learn why Duchess Lars despises Ruve so much? I read the manga and then switched over to binge the novel, but I'm not sure if I missed this anywhere.
She knows he is not of noble blood (the mother was a maid), and without him her sons would have the throne by default (she is the sister of the Emperor after all).
I registered just to like your post because what you said can’t be more right. I can’t believe after actually experienced the trauma of being raped, her father got killed and miscarriage. She’s still got back to the guy. Let’s pretend that the 2nd guy is a different guy with another personality. It will be more believable if the FL is from another world, who reads the novel, knows about it and prevents it before it happened. Then she will fall in love with him then yes. Rather than a victim, she came back to the past and married the trauma, like what? 100 chapters, she’s constantly reminds herself to stay away from him. Then she married the guy??? Like wt*? As a victim of PTSD for nearly 20 years with a similar experience, i swear even in 2nd or 100th timeline, in my mind i always, always think about how I wish him death, even though that was evil, but no, i will run away from him whatever i can. Ridiculous for anyone who protects the story or the ML. The author must check mental illnesses on paper.
Indeed. It is a fictional world, so they can root for this ending or even like Ruve all they want. What is concerning however is that both the author and some readers are selling the story on the basis of a "true love story". No way. Carsein showed true love by risking his life and respecting her choices in everything, proving to be an awesome support. Allen showed true love by owercoming his own demons by completely giving up on her just so she would be safe from him and his dark thoughts. Ruve? He was pushy and had a sad past... Love need a reason, and this ship had none in both timelines. Also, Ruve decided to stay away from her during childhood because she was afraid of him... Fine. But are we supposed to belive that he didn't bother to send at least one letter to try to amend their relashionship or even make sure she was alright after realizing that he was completly misundertanding her? He clearly don't deserve her. Period. And this story makes no sense. He only started to get attracted to her when lust showed up (as seen in all his POV since it is the one thinh he is always talking about). The letters that he didn't send where written after he was already attracted to her. Ergo, he only made efforts when he started to want her. Talk about a "good boy".
@Rika77 , @Lamune44 , @ringu412 Correct, just because these people find no flaws in the story doesn't mean others didn't. some people subconsciously ignore the flaws of something because they really like that certain something. even i like a certain story yet is willing to acknowledge the bad part of it because it simply doesn't cut it just because the author wishes for it.
Oh for the love of god can someone can we tall about someone else?? Like? The main Antagonist? Jien? Jihen? Totally forgot her name but like. Make me remember it please. I dont know anything about her, but I heard that's shes a really interesting antagonist and I'd like to ask why?
That is the thing, she is not an interesting antagonist either. She blames everyone for her misfortunes when most of what happened to her was because of karma or because of her own actions. She don't see what she did wrong, did nothing really worthy of talking about in the second timeline except saving Tia once. One good action does not erase all that she did. She said it herself: Tia did all the work (be it the actual work or the revenge part). Of course, I can be biased because I didn't like her, but seriously most of the time she was evil just for the sake of being evil. She made everything harder for everyone in both timeline for no other reason that inferiority complex. The very fact that this inferiority complex started after only two or three meeting with Tia in the first timeline, making her "jealous" and unwilling to intervene when she knew just how badly and unfairly Tia was being treated by others AND that she kept her mindset in the second timeline knowing that Tia was a victim and had been framed tell you all you need to know about her character. She can't even properly apologize (she only did it one at the start of the story for coming between Ruve and Tia when she did worst things after).
This is a story about a girl who travels through time set in a psuedo-feudal world with magic and where god is a glowing star. There is another girl who also time traveled and is from modern-day Korea. I would say that "because the author wants to" is exactly how these sorts of stories pan out because logically, these stories wouldn't even happen in the first place. There is also no shame in liking something that has flaws. Unfortunately, when you start coming in to aggressively shit on things people like in a space where people who want to like the thing gather, don't be surprised to find push back, especially if you're going to drop nuclear takes like "THE FL LEAD ENDS UP WITH HER RAPIST."
However, it's not a space where only people who liked the story gather. It is a place where readers talk about their thoughts on the story. Many were appalled by the ending for a reason and have the right to explain why. The story is not "that" bad, but it is NOT a good love story and the villains are unidimensional. Other books have the same formula and didn't create such a negative reaction because it was made better. I didn't have such a strong reaction to "I don't want to be loved" for exemple. It's that simple. It is even more aggravating that Yuna sold it under the premise of a "true love story" when it was not. Their relashionship is awkward and messed up from beggining to end. The character development of the crown prince makes no sense. There is no reason at all for them to fall in love with each other, so it is really painfull to read and feel very forced. Many readers clearly share this impression. It is not a simple question of taste or not liking what the author have choose to do because our favorite ship did not happen. This story is just disturbing.
this story was terrible. I cant even tell if she has stolkholm or if she is just a retard at this point
So essentially what you're saying is because you don't like the story, it's horrible and should not exist. It's ok to dislike a story, but just because you dislike it does not mean your opinions and those that disagree about it are the correct ones. There is legitimate criticism in how in media female characters will end up with men who treated them horribly, but that's a different topic for a another day. In fact, by your own admission, you don't have a reaction to a extremely similar story. If you hate awkward and messed up relationships, then you should have had the same aversion to "I Don't Want to be Loved" as your complaints about The Abandoned Empress can apply to that story also. Instead, I think the answer is clear: you don't like the story, characters, and writing. That's fine! There are some novels/webtoons out there that I don't like either despite enjoying the genre. However getting angry that it's not a "true love story" is highly subjective; people who enjoy the series will see it that way and those that don't are definitely not going to agree. And honestly, this sort of advertising isn't unique to this story only; many of the romance novels/webtoons advertise themselves as a "true love story" because... that's what the romance genre is about. You can also argue that most of them aren't really "true love" because there's usually something dysfunctional going on, but that's one reason why they're fictional stories. You say that it was painful and disturbing for you and the experience is the same for "many others", but for the experience is obviously not the same for me and other readers. I mean, if you look on Tappytoon, it's one of their more popular series with over 3 million views; in the spoilers thread that got locked, people mentioned how in Korea most people were fine with the ending. In fact, the fact that it got a manhwa adaption is proof of it's popularity - despite the story already being finished. It's clear that people wanted more and it's doing pretty well. You also don't elaborate further on your problems with the story other than you don't like. What is it that you feel their relationship awkward and messed up? How does the development of the crown prince confuse you? What do you consider a "true love story" and under what premise do you think the author should have sold it under? Why do you consider this story disturbing? You keep framing that the story is bad, but your reasoning for it so far is basically "because I don't like it."