Discussion The Abandoned Empress

Discussion in 'Novel Discussion' started by flamingorangesoof, Mar 26, 2020.

  1. Lamune44

    Lamune44 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2020
    Messages:
    86
    Likes Received:
    674
    Reading List:
    Link
    For me it was her treatment of Carsein that made me dislike her. Not because she didn't choose him, but because she clearly took him for granted and conveniently forgot about him whe she was too busy being lovey-dovey. Even Carsein realized it and told her that he was sad she didn't came to check up on him after he was injured. He turned it into a joke of forgave her, but still... Girl, he is your precious childhood friend and one of the rare person who trully have your back. The least you can do is worrying about him without having to be told to.
     
    Arye, Mellogang, Uhteen and 12 others like this.
  2. KoiPrince

    KoiPrince Member

    Joined:
    Apr 10, 2020
    Messages:
    10
    Likes Received:
    13
    Reading List:
    Link
    Ahem, okay. I had high expectations for this one but ya know, since the ML is the prince why even bother. I get cheated of my feelings as I get attached to red boi and green boi but tia doesn’t really gives two fucks about them. Why even have two supporting male leads when it’s painful obviously their only role is to be damnass cannon fodders. Like if you’re gonna try to redeem the prince and bullshit at least spend more time on the prince. But no. Prince appears every once in the blue moon, you get attach to supporting male leads, and BAM, nope, still gonna end up with shitty prince. Wtf even. It’s like reading this whole comic but making zero progress.
    Also, the god of that world is fucking stupid. Okay maybe I can get you wanna bring your daughter over to this world and let her have a fucking good life and whatnot but srsly why the fuck would you ‘benevolently’ rebirth tia when you knew she has a bone to pick with your precious daughter?? Like honestly the whole beginning and point behind this comic is just brainless shit to move the plot along.
     
    Arye, Mellogang, Taruna and 7 others like this.
  3. shelldon

    shelldon Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 13, 2018
    Messages:
    72
    Likes Received:
    63
    Reading List:
    Link
    This comment had some accurate points to jieun, tia and ruve. I still dont like jiuen because she has her fair of selfishness while acting like a victim. Tia is also a victim but she did not think much through of that because of her way to survive. Well the story had some plot holes and actually it could be written better with more in depth of their character. But still for me, i find this novel good because it hinders the fact that jenna is the true villain in both timelines. I am more on Carsein but since tia is still in love with ruve and they become happy then i am okay with it. Afterall it is said that their son adrian had become the emperor of all time and after years of marriage the empire is thriving and succesful. Keiran is also happy and died at an old age. But still i felt the author may needs to have another version like rebirth on the same timeline so that this so called 1st ruve have his own regret to alive tia.
     
    i love tea likes this.
  4. Lamune44

    Lamune44 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2020
    Messages:
    86
    Likes Received:
    674
    Reading List:
    Link
    They could have been the endgame. There is thousand of ways to go about it, like in Lady to queen or I don't want to be loved. The problem is that the author shooted that done at the moment she based their second chance at a love story on "they are fated" (then you don't get to say that she is the pionneer who choosed her own path because she had no reason to love him in both timelines) and on the fact that Tia never got over her feelings for him when she shouldn't even have them in the first place (in the first timeline they didn't know each others and he quickly became abusive, even humiliating her when they were still children, and in the second timeline the trauma and the knowledge of what he is going to do if not stopped should made her unwilling to give him a chance even if he became a better version). Yes, second Ruve should not be held accountable for First Ruve. But Tia remember and to overcome that just being "better" than his previous self is not enough anymore, even more so when better options were availables. They needed to base their relationship on new grounds and it was not the case. There was more talk than anything else. He is not the one who helped her overcome her trauma and in fact mostly came across as an antagonist for a good part of the novel, since Tia supposedly wanted to break free from him. The "actions" he did take can be seen in double layers (see second paragraph).

    And this is where the second problem, that I will call the "subtext", start. A great misconception about the readers who didn't like this story is that they came in ready to hate the story because of the endgame and doing so are blind to what the author wanted to tell. That is not the truth. I am fully ready to adknowledge that the author was not trying to shift the blame to Tia, to present there relationship as toxic and so on. However, the problem is that in the end this is what we got from reading the story while analyzing the actions of the characters and the storytelling. For Ruve actions, because of the first timeline readers were not supposed to see him in a good light. Then we saw that his hatred took his roots way before they were married since he was fully ready to humiliate her at their first dance and he already resented her. Then he read the letter and leave her alone. First mistake: because we are prejudicied with the prologue the "he leave her alone" is not understood as "He is afraid to hurt her" but can only be understood as an other show of neglet, the same way he did in the first timeline. He just saw her catatonic because of him, realized that she is not after power after all, but don't bother sending at least one letter to apologize or to try to amend their relationship. Then they meet again with Tia becoming a knight. With Allen point of view we can see when he actually started to be attracted: the fire in the garden scene. By this point Tia became even better. He THEN start to trully take action to get her. The feeling "he is only doing it because he is attracted but would have neglected her if he didn't" is here, and it will stay. Then we saw how he reacted to the Princesses, not very far from how he treated First Tia, and we have the confimartion that he is not that different from First Ruve after all. Then the "actions" keep being twisted: didn't he refuse to take Tia as Empress and Ji-eun as concubine only to save himself because he saw the look of hatred that even the Emperor saw? Not to help Tia after all?). He say that he will let her choose, but later on refuse twice to break the engament, even lying about it, when they would have been no political repercution at this stage (they was even a new candidate)... By the "Happy ending" and his married life POV nothing have changed. We learn that if Tia isn't here he will lash out at the staff (he did it twice), that he don't know Tia as well as Carsein do...

    All in all, the "love story" seemed to purely be based on attraction. That is not enough, not when such brutal abuse is involved. I can't understand either how readers can say that they already loved each other in the first timeline becaue they didn't know each other; Ruve had to ask himself "What kind of woman were you"? and in Tia's case it was clearly obsession. This is why I just can't even get on the "as long as they are happy" side, because that just feels like a mockery of trauma and extremely unatural as well as unrealistic.
     
    Last edited: Aug 6, 2020
    i love tea, Taruna, CottonKey and 4 others like this.
  5. shelldon

    shelldon Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 13, 2018
    Messages:
    72
    Likes Received:
    63
    Reading List:
    Link
    I am glad we are on the same boat that it is not bad that tia and ruve could be the end game. I also felt the story went too fast and shoot it immediately after allen left. You are right there are more ways to amplify the chemistry getting to know more of each them understand their pain and feelings better. As pioneer, she managed to be the heir of her household, gain some friends and did not hold back to her feelings, i could see she is pushing away the fate of being a concubine again for she rejected him numerous times and i felt some scenes could be added to portray more of being a pioneer.
    About 1st life, i think tia fell in love with him on their first dance but unfortunately he let her fall so she decided to wear mask. I do not see her obessive with ruve but seen her a woman hoping to be recognized at least, it was evident on rape scene. I had read some novel same scene and all the girls were actually permitting it hoping for his love. And just like mention of miscarrige, ruve destroy her chance to be with him. For ruve, i noticed it somehow that he love her but he is not aware of it and taken jieun instead because she saying i love you to him. i know that ruve jieun did not live happily but you know ruve did not care with dead tia until after 4 years of her death. It just said he miss her thats all, there is no such anguish just regret when he is about to die. The author could put more scenes on here to add more drama. About the trauma i am seeing tia is becoming resilient over time so she had recovered.
    Well overall i still liked this novel it is just that there could be some ways to make more saucy and thrilling without destroying the story but showing more of in depth character. I am rereading the novel again and putting effort in connecting the dots of their pov story despite of some plot holes i am still enjoying it. I think both of us could be a good critic.
     
    Last edited: Aug 6, 2020
  6. Emile

    Emile Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2020
    Messages:
    21
    Likes Received:
    76
    Reading List:
    Link
    Agreed. I liked the mature ver of her in the first TL while I'm not a fan in her 2nd one. very emotional, what do you think happened to her mother because she's like that. Oh right, she's dead lmao.

    These people defending the novel can't accept the fact that Ruve changed because she changed first. He became a good and wise ruler because he stopped being envious of MC? Indeed, what a joke.

    If K-novels have taught me anything, it's that k-novel stans will defend anyone or anything as long as they're the MC or hot.

    They ignore the problematical parts and concentrate on what is comforting and meaningful to them.
     
    Last edited: Aug 14, 2020
    Mellogang, Taruna, Turbostop and 4 others like this.
  7. Deleted member 262282

    Deleted member 262282 Guest

    Reading List:
    Link
    :blob_plusone::blob_plusone:
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 22, 2020
  8. Xylade

    Xylade Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 29, 2020
    Messages:
    28
    Likes Received:
    74
    Reading List:
    Link
    +1

    EMOTIONALLY EXPRESSIVE ≠ EMOTIONAL MATURITY
     
    Taruna and Dimension Breaker like this.
  9. Lourie

    Lourie Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2020
    Messages:
    10
    Likes Received:
    71
    Reading List:
    Link
    As someone who was physically and mentally abused by the person who I thought I "loved", and has read a shit ton of literary works about victims of PTSD, I must say I have never been this angry at a webtoon before.

    I'll be focusing on chapters 7-68, where the FL unrealistically goes from "I'm fucking terrified of the ML" to "Yeah I guess we're cool now. Let's talk about flowers, hm?" My focus is Tia and Tia only. Beware this will be detailed and long af. Bear with me.

    The first two times she meets the ML, she's scared shitless. She freezes, is unable to talk, etc. Understandable reaction. Moving on.

    The third time, she bumps into him and goes, "He must be mad at me. Why isnt he mad at me?" "Why do you always look at me with resentment and hatred?" All she thinks about is him, him, him, him. Girl why don't you ask yourself if you're okay with meeting your killer?! Why do you have to keep wondering about him? Aren't you the victim here?

    In ch. 25 during a play, ML agrees that Tia looked cute the other day, and she blushes. Yep, if my torturer said I looked cute I'd definitely blush too, instead of puking my guts out.
    After the falling chandelier accident, she thinks, "Are we not meant to be together after all?" Is she... is she mentally retarded? Or is she really just that dumb? God himself told her that she's the wrong choice so why is she still-

    Anyway, moving on. In ch. 34, he escorts her home and she's all, "Why? I thought he hated me?" When he leaves, she thinks, "Why do I feel so empty? Perhaps he escorted me because he was worried about me." I shit you not. I was so fucking close to throwing my phone against the wall.

    Miss? Did you perhaps lose your brain cells after being reborn? I wonder how such a thought even CROSSED her mind. She should be fantasizing about shooting arrows into his body, not that bullshit. Keep in mind this is only their fifth meeting.

    In ch. 43 at the ML's coming of age party, she stands right next to him and links arms with him. She doesn't even think twice about it. Wow. One would think that being in such close proximity with one's torturer will make one feel nauseous at the very least. But nuh-uh. Not our MC. She looks just fine, nothing to worry about. She's already at that stage of healing where she doesn't mind being near him and touching him. We love fast development, don't we?

    Later, she goes outside and says, "It's suffocating." Oh FINALLY!! Does this mean she didn't actually like being near him, after all? I thought she's already overcome her trauma. I guess I was wrong, phew.

    But then she follows up with, "I feel nauseous....... from the crowd."

    Pardon???:blobsmile: So being in close proximity with her torturer/killer doesn't suffocate her but the crowd does? Has she lost her damn mind?:blobsmile:

    In ch. 52 when he visits her castle, she serves him his favorite food and drinks. Why? Why is she like this? Who the FUCK- who in their right mind would VOLUNTARILY serve their torturer, killer of their child, with their favorite food (unless it's laced with poison)? At this point, I thought Tia was the crazy one, not the ML.

    Then, ML triggers her PTSD. She's unresponsive for some time, has a dream about her past and present, wakes up, reads a letter from Allen that says, "Please don't trap yourself in the past only to neglect the present. I know how wise you are, so I know you can overcome this." Nice words, really.

    Tia is like "Oh wow true!!! I guess I'm different now?? I'm okay:blob_sunglasses:" I truly envy how easy it is for her to be okay again after she's just had an "episode". Look, I'm not saying that she should dwell in her depression and all. I'm just saying: I wish it was that easy in real life.

    And now we finally get to chapter 68, where she meets the ML again after some time. This is their eighth encounter (she's 14/15 now). Last time they met, he triggered her PTSD. Now? She has no such concerns like, "What if the same thing happens again? What if after all this time, I still can't stand him? What if the progress I've made this far means nothing?" None of that happens. She only feels a bit awkward and agrees to go on a walk with him. Instead of being wary and on guard around him, she just casually chats with him like old friends, talking about flowers. Yes, flowers. No shit.

    At this point, I was so confused. I checked to see if maybe I had missed a few chapters? Did I unknowingly skip her character growth? Why is she acting normal around him now? How-

    All right. Try to calm down, brain.

    If you say, "Yea but the ML is different tho? He's not the same person. It's like two different people entirely. Plus, he's still a child." My God, IT DOESN'T MATTER! What matters the most is how the author so badly handled how victims of PTSD deal with their trauma. Let's put ourselves in Tia's shoes:
    1. She doesn't know that past ML was constantly poisoned with psychotic drugs.
    2. She doesn't know that present ML is starting to slowly "change for the better". Only us readers know that, because we've seen his pov.

    Repeat: SHE DOESN'T KNOW SHIT. All she knows is: this dude, no matter how young he is presently, was the one who killed her unborn baby, her father, and her. His face alone is a constant reminder that he was the one who raped, psychologically tortured, and thought she was worse than dirt for years with no regret whatsoever. Period. So it drives me absolutely insane why she would treat him so kindly.

    You may argue that "it took years for her to get to that point." Okay then. We're talking four, five years at most?
    1. During that time, did she consult with an expert or an adult on how to properly deal with her horrible past? No. She could easily use "I keep having this horrible nightmare, could you please help me?" as an excuse, but nope. No expert was consulted with.

    2. Next, "She can overcome it because she has a strong support system." Tell me, how many people know about Tia's past life? Allen, her Dad, and the ML. Allen (a psycho teen) straight up didn't trust her at first, her Dad basically only said, "You're strong for overcoming that," then there is no more conversation about it. Case closed. As for the ML, he knows not because Tia trusted him enough to tell him everything, but because the little shit has read a personal letter from Tia's close friend. Did he perhaps skip all his etiquette lessons growing up? He may be the future Emperor, but he has no fucking right to do such a thing. He and Tia are basically strangers. He does not deserve to know about her trauma without her fucking consent, just because he's cUriOuS why she doesn't seem to like him.

    Also, guess what? His advisor also knows the contents of that VERY PRIVATE LETTER. Wow:blobsmile: How nice of him:blobsmile: I'm amazed:blobsmile: It took her years to gather the courage to tell the truth to her two loved ones, yet now he knows everything too. I am so pissed off. No wonder the Emperor always compares him to Tia, he's an idiot.

    While it is true that having a support system helps a whole lot in overcoming one's trauma, in Tia's case, who exactly has helped her deal with her past trauma? Every time someone asks if she's okay, she lies and says that she is. Is that what you call healing? Being helped by the people around you?
    I agree with this statement:

    3. And how about exposure treatment? How many times has she interacted with the ML up to ch. 68? Eight, ladies and gentlemen.
    • First three times she's scared.
    • Fourth time, she turns into a blushing maiden because he calls her cute (Uh, what?).
    • Fifth time, she feels empty when he leaves her and wonders if he's worried about her (Again, wha-?).
    • Sixth time, she's okay with being near him. 10/10. No problemo.
    • Seventh time, she has an "episode", triggered by the one and only ML.
    • Eighth time, they're okay. A bit awkward, but they talk about flowers which is nice, isn't it?:blobsmile:
    Phew. So, she received no counseling/help from any adult (except her Dad), only spoke about her past twice, always said "I'm fine" when asked, yet suddenly she's now okay with chatting casually with the ML? Great. Fantastic character development. Superb writing.

    The author didn't see fit to include small yet important developments like:
    "I can now look him in the eye without feeling terrified."
    "I can be in the same room as him without wanting to pull my hair out."
    "I can stand close to him without feeling repulsed."
    "I can look at his face without being reminded of how badly he mistreated me in the past."


    We don't see that kind of development, do we?

    1st ML was literally Tia's entire world, her one and only, yet she was constantly dragged through the dirt by him, psychologically tortured, raped, told her baby wasn't worth shit (despite not having been BORN yet), and had a miscarriage because of him. He then manipulated her into thinking that he'd killed her dad and forced her to surrender the ONE THING left she held high at that time, her pride. He mentally crucified her, again and again.

    All that, and she was only 17 years old.

    Please, please tell me how you expect me to believe that this teenage girl dealt with this kind of trauma and abuse and hatred in just a few years, with barely any help?

    The story would've been far better if the author had elaborated more on Tia dealing with her trauma instead of bombarding us with THREE potential love interests right from the beginning.

    Again I say: IT! DOESN'T! FUCKING! MATTER! IF THE ML IN 1ST AND 2ND LIVES ARE DIFFERENT. What matters is how the author wrote the worst fate that a woman - in this case, a GIRL - could possibly endure, yet somehow in ch. 68 she's already all cool and talking about flowers with the ML. So fast, eh? What character development? Meh. Not important.

    True. Let's talk a bit about Allen. Do you know that scene in ch. 22 where he towers and leans over her? As a rape victim, I thought her PTSD might get triggered being caged in like that BY A MAN, seeing as the ML had done that to her right before raping her. But I guess what Allen did was okay for her, huh? Girls like that kind of thing right? Why would she be triggered by that right?

    I'm at a loss for words.

    My point is: The way the author handled a PTSD victim's horrible trauma was absolutely unacceptable and no one can change my mind.

    P.S. Based on these reasons, I dropped the story after ch. 90 or something and read the detailed spoilers afterwards. Apparently, after much "trials", she inevitably ended up with the prince. Whatever.
     
    Last edited: Mar 26, 2021
  10. Deleted member 262282

    Deleted member 262282 Guest

    Reading List:
    Link
    after seeing tia's amazing(?) character development, can I dare to say that casein is too good for tia? [even though I am a strong sein x tia shipper]
    It still doesn't make sense how she chose ruve lol [I dunno how he even ended up becoming a love interest]
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 23, 2020
    Taruna likes this.
  11. Lamune44

    Lamune44 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2020
    Messages:
    86
    Likes Received:
    674
    Reading List:
    Link
    Indeed, Carsein is way too good for her. For Ji-eun, what made her a good villainess in your opinion? For me she was the usual delusional villainess with misplaced grudges and always playing the victim. It made her unidimensinal. Her plan was a mess too. She caused more damage to Tia, the victim, than to the true culprites of her situation. Even with her misplaced grudge against Tia, trying to obtain the cooperation of Tia and Ruve against Zena would have been the right course of action for exemple. I mean, it would have helped her gain favorability with Ruve, what she wanted in the First place. By acting the mean and scheaming woman she ruined her chances...
     
  12. Lamune44

    Lamune44 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2020
    Messages:
    86
    Likes Received:
    674
    Reading List:
    Link
    Nice analysis. It is a shame that you did not read the novel however, you could have explained better than me how the author ended up, willingly or not, shifting the blame to Tia.
     
    Taruna and Dimension Breaker like this.
  13. melomarl

    melomarl Burning Red

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2019
    Messages:
    1,559
    Likes Received:
    15,024
    Reading List:
    Link
    i'm mainly here for the tea.... don't mind this random passerby :blob_coffee:
    But I do enjoy the arguments.... so sophisticated

    I might have read the novel before but it went down the spiralling abyss of my bad memory so I won't be able to contribute
    Ah... this tea is good *nods nods*
     
    aShinyVaporeon and shelldon like this.
  14. Lourie

    Lourie Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2020
    Messages:
    10
    Likes Received:
    71
    Reading List:
    Link
    I must admit I did enjoy the webtoon at the beginning, since I was eager to see how the FL would train herself to be a badass genius and finally stand up for herself. I mean, she literally rejected god right in front of his face lmao what could be more badass than that? Her relationship with her Papa (2nd timeline) was a big plus point as well.

    However, I was simply too bothered by her quick and nonsensical "character development" that I simply couldn't stand it anymore.

    I do plan on reading the full novel/webtoon, just not in the near future because I've read all the spoilers. But I'm curious to see for myself how often this:
    happens for the rest of the story.

    ••••

    Now, I'd like to further address the opposing side, those of you who think that this is a good novel:

    I've read your arguments as well and while I agree with some of your points, I still have my doubts.

    You say that the FL thinks of the ML (2nd) as a different person entirely. Yes, that is possible. But you can't deny that he's a walking trigger for her, right?

    Not to mention she becomes an Empress at the end, correct? Which means she has to live at the Palace? A place where all the bad shit happened to her in her past life. Again, another constant reminder of her trauma.

    Imagine if, at one point in their relationship, the ML got angry and raised his voice at her (he's short tempered, isn't he?).
    Would she flinch and freeze at the spot?
    Would she fall into a catatonic state again?
    Would she hate herself for reacting that way even though she knows the man in front of her is not the same one from her past life?
    Would she hate herself even more over the fact that she thought she was okay, that she was over it, only to find out that she wasn't?
    How long would it take for her to fix herself all over again?
    And how many times would this cycle repeat itself?

    If you say that it's not fair for the ML (2nd) to be blamed for something he did in his past life, then I'm sorry but it seems like you don't know much about the way PTSD works after all.

    Let's consider this as an easy example: "A war veteran never really left the battlefield behind. He took the war home."
    They think an object falling to the floor is a grenade exploding.
    A door being shut too hard is like a gun firing.
    They hear someone scream and it's like hearing someone dying.

    Simple, harmless, everyday things become a threat to them. That's the thing about PTSD. It's not about being "fair", nothing about PTSD is fair. Your brain is just rewired to think that it's a threat, a trigger, even though you know that it's not, that you're safe and sound and there's nothing to worry about.

    The way your brain works is rewired because of PTSD and there is nothing you can do about it but to force yourself to heal.

    It takes years and years to get rid of PTSD. It comes and goes without warning. It creeps up on you when you least expect it. For some people, it stays with them until the day they die.

    Going back to Tia's case, she might be fine now with the ML. Everything might be going okay. But remember, he's a walking trigger and she lives at the palace, which is also a trigger for her.

    Her PTSD is a ticking time bomb, really. And we never know when or how many times that bomb will explode. This is why I have some doubts about their "happily ever after" ending.

    If the author thinks that their love for one another can overcome that big hurdle, then I guess it's fine. It's possible. It is her story, after all.

    For me, I still think Tia's ending is tragic.
     
    Last edited: Aug 23, 2020
  15. Lamune44

    Lamune44 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2020
    Messages:
    86
    Likes Received:
    674
    Reading List:
    Link
    I might be too harsh to say short-tempered, but what was I supposed to understand from his POV? That is even more true when de know what he is capable of. Exemple in the chapter 354 (really dont want to have to reread everything).

    Chapter 354

    "Only now could he reminisce with a smile, but he had to calm down his violent temper several times a day whenever he thought about her back then. Anyway, people around her valued her so much that he knew if he hurt her once more, she would not really look back at him again."

    "As if they noticed he was in a bad mood, his assistants hurriedly handled their assigned work. He smiled, watching them working hard, who had been on alert for more than a month.

    If the empress were with him now, he would cheer them up with comforting words, but he didn’t feel up to it now. In fact, it was her way of appeasing them, not his.

    ”If you feel bad, bring the empress back here.’

    Suddenly, he felt out of sorts, so he snatched the document from one of his aides and opened the first page.

    How come they are so slow-witted! They could have scratched his itch if he was hesitant for the sake of his honor.

    ‘Well, he’s the only guy who is quick-witted to know what I want.’

    When he recalled the guy’s broad and sly smile, he felt frustrated, hysterically turning over the document."
     
    Taruna likes this.
  16. Deleted member 262282

    Deleted member 262282 Guest

    Reading List:
    Link
    maybe that was the case.. you know she was reborn and that brain cells do not replicate. LMAO
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 22, 2020
    Taruna and Alina AquaRegilia like this.
  17. Deleted member 262282

    Deleted member 262282 Guest

    Reading List:
    Link
    she basically knew absolutely nothing about this world. she gets thrown into politics as soon as she gets isekaid and doesn't even have time to calm her mental state. The reason she agreed to marry the CP was because Duke Zenna told her she would be thrown out into the streets otherwise. keep in mind that even though she received education on earth she would not be able to learn how to play the role of the empress in such a short period of time. no matter how much time she spends she would not be up to the level in comparison to tia [who had been educated from her childhood]. Jieun opted to try again (after she was even a second chance) because she wanted to prove that she could measure up to Tia and even surpass her. speaking from jieun's perspective I don't think she would have even thought of obtaining co operation with tia and ruve as she basically came back with the intent of revenge on ruve and duke zenna. also I don't think her pride would have allowed it. note that she only knew tia and ruve of the 1st timeline. one loathed her and the other whispered sweet words to her but betrayed her faith in the end even going as far as to call her a burden. so she doesn't actually know how their personalities are in the 2nd timeline. so she is basically all alone. Her main motivation is to get revenge on Ruve and duke zenna. also just by getting into Ruve's good books is not enough to hurt him to the point of extremity as that guy is obsessed with tia. of course this is just my personal opinion of course.
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    ARISTIA: so the love I had for him was all an emotion decided by fate? I refuse to accept a fate like that! I will refuse you with all my life!
    ALSO ARISTIA: I love you too ruve!
    Can I repent on how I thought Tia was cool
    Also comparing how Ruve behaved towards her in both timelines I am constantly finding fault in Ruve for not liking Tia as a whole but fitting her into a character he likes- the emotional one. [AM I THE ONLY ONE WHO THINKS THAT??:hmm::hmm:] he hates tia just because he was constantly compared to her and doesn't even try to understand her a bit. Does he not know that royals must not show their emotions openly? Being a royal himself should he not have recognised that?? he did not even sense tia's loneliness and yearning for him. He did not realise that there was a fragile side of her beneath her social mask. He wouldn't have gotten attracted to Tia if it wasn't for his curiosity [ why is tia scared of him without him doing anything to her; in the 2nd timeline] It was Carsein (can I fangirl abt him for a moment?:blobnosebleed:) who loved tia for who she was. Also remember how Jeremia requested Ruve to look after Tia in her last moments? And that jerk kills of her entire family! god! I don't have anymore words to say... And yes not to mention he also read Tia's PERSONAL LETTER which was addressed to Allen WITHOUT her permission and even tries to ask her about it? for the love of god does he not know etiquette being the crown prince and all? and even his personal aide knows the contents..like seriously? and refusing to accept her vow during her knighthood ceremony and accepting it only after tying her up with an engagement that she does not desire.... like how immature is that? forced kiss? how creepy.. dude you raped her once and you expect her to enjoy it [ well she did but.. BUT..] he even went as far as to destroy her reputation by bringing her to a secluded room? I don't even know why tia loved HIM in the first place when there were better guys surrounding her..[even in the first timeline] I don't understand. he was cold towards her during the 1st timeline and even executed her and her father whom she loved she had a miscarriage because of him. she was also poisoned which made her barren, was forced to take care of the duties of an empress and her reputation was bad and she had to bear it all and yeah she did. just because she loved him. she was also forced to give up on the one last thing she desperately held onto.. her pride as a queen.. her pride as a Monique.. her pride as Aristia. honestly I feel bad for her. UGH! even though she swore she won't fall in love with him again, and after all she had gone through she still had feelings for him in the 2nd timeline like.. wth? there wasn't even enough interactions between them.. I won't ever ever ever EVER forgive ruvellis and I won't forgive tia for choosing him. I won't forgive keiran for not advising tia about ruve [but I still like him for respecting her decisions]
    ----------------------------------------------------------------
    I thought I would just write one or two lines but it ended up like this:sweating_profusely::sweating_profusely: but this is just my personal opinion..:blob_coughblood:
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 24, 2020
  18. Lamune44

    Lamune44 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2020
    Messages:
    86
    Likes Received:
    674
    Reading List:
    Link
    You are definitly not the only one who tought that Ruve don't actually like her as a whole but only a part of Her and that Carsein understood her way better. For Ji-eun, I cant stand how she is playing the victim. Being transmigrated by God is definitly unfortunate. But after that her own actions determined her fate. The fact that she accepted To take controle of an Empire whose language she could'nt even read, letting her blackmailer play her, being completly insentitive (be it toward her own husband or the woman she put in a difficult position but still expect unconditional friendship for some reason...). Even Her inferiority complex toward Tia. Not only does it show what kind of character she has she would have felt the same way for any other concubine. I mean, she didn't work at all. Anyone was better than her at this point. If she was a real person, I would not want her close to me.

    For Her plan, she wanted Ruve To fall in love with Her. She knew his taste (at least in.women), how she should act. And... proceeded to antagonize him and act like a snake. Not a good idea. As I said, cooperating with Tia and Ruve To take down Zena and then take revenge against them would have actually helped her way more than Her actual half-assed plan. What have Tia actually done To her for Ji-eun to not even think of at least tell Her what trully happened in the First timeline? She know that Tia was innocent and tortured by Ruve... Having a clever ally in one of the highest noble families should have outweighted Her wounded pride to get even with her killer.
     
  19. Deleted member 262282

    Deleted member 262282 Guest

    Reading List:
    Link
    damn..the moment when casein kissed tia I literally got tears in ma eyes.
    it's not like I'm completely agreeing with jieun's actions she's got her faults too. personally I like her as a villainess..
     
  20. Aria23

    Aria23 New Member

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2020
    Messages:
    3
    Likes Received:
    1
    Reading List:
    Link
    We can see in the beginning that she never quite lost her feelings for Ruveliss. That moment when she wonders if he was worried about her,it shows that she still has some feelings for him.

    It was her choice to be with him. She also mentions that this Ruveliss is different from the first timeline. I don't think it's tragic since she had agency this time.