LCD The Desolate Era

Discussion in 'Latest Chapter Discussion' started by JJ, Nov 4, 2015.

  1. Viola

    Viola Studio Ghibli Fanboy Mother of Learning Fanboy

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    Ya but what else is Solesky going to do that Ning can't do for himself?
    The only thing I came up with was bodyguard, any other ideas?
     
  2. VinnyOni1

    VinnyOni1 Well-Known Member

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    Everyone overestimates the power of the hegemon seal because it contains the power from a hegemon. That seal could at best injure one of 8 heads of the alliance. It doesn't contain the full might of the hegemon, or rather for it to release the full might of an hegemon the user would have to be near that power as well. And that's not taking in account how ever powerful daolord seems able to get their hands on defensive skill of equal might. So I imagine eternal emperor could get one as well. And if Solesky was the trashiest of trash then how come he and Vastheaven were able to protect their sect for so long? Many times the author described him as strong. Ning greatest lifesaving treasure is the seal from the spacetime hegemon. Attacks can be defended from but if you teleport from one end of the endless terrority to another, the other party will have a hard time finding you let alone killing you. And Ninedust is Ning's friend so of couse he would think he needs repaying. Ninedust was helping Ning out, not Solesky. In an early chapter it stated how Ninedust had schemes about it.
    From the end of book 32 Chapter 11 and the beginning of Chapter 12.
     
    Last edited: Oct 1, 2017
  3. Viola

    Viola Studio Ghibli Fanboy Mother of Learning Fanboy

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    Dude you keep quoting the wrong people, please edit.
     
  4. AardwarkThe2nd

    AardwarkThe2nd (R-18 writer) Aardwark, the king of aardvarks!

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    Yeah, Solesky is basically useless. No treasures that can compare to a Hegemon Daoseal, no specialities that can be useful to Ji Ning (Badlands can locate treasures), no way to get treasures to help Ji Ning out (only his aquaform keeps him from being a target of failed Verge Daolords who want to kill him for a last hurrah), no great relations with higher powers...
     
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  5. VinnyOni1

    VinnyOni1 Well-Known Member

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    To help save space in the forum I'll put my response in a quote.

    haha that's funny, Ning through the power of being a MC has obtain plenty of treasure that are better than a hegemon seal. May not have the same instant huge power of one but that sand he got for his swords is more useful than the seal and those beads that he used to make that seal is more useful than a hegemon seal. If only Solesky was the MC then all would be forgiven lol. I'm rooting for Solesky to train to a high level and become comparable to a city lord at least. I think he has the drive.
     
    Last edited: Oct 1, 2017
  6. AardwarkThe2nd

    AardwarkThe2nd (R-18 writer) Aardwark, the king of aardvarks!

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    The problem is that all the places where you can obtain something precious like Hegemon Daoseals or comparable treasures are restricted to Daolords. The Sword Hegemon's legacy, the Waveshift World... all of them are places where Solesky cannot tread or he will be killed.

    See, you said it yourself. Solesky in too weak to get useful treasures for Ning and too weak to help him out. When Solesky's power level is elaborated on in the future chapters, he will still be trash while Ji Ning goes against City Lords.

    Useless now, useless later, useless overall.
     
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  7. VinnyOni1

    VinnyOni1 Well-Known Member

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    After I finished typing and editing I noticed that my statement is super long again, so into quotes it goes.
     
    Last edited: Oct 1, 2017
  8. Viola

    Viola Studio Ghibli Fanboy Mother of Learning Fanboy

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    My point is that Ning can go and get anything that Solesky would be able to go get for him. There is nothing Solesky can now do that Ning himself is unable to do aswell. The only marked advantage Solesky has is defense but that doesn't help him beat or overpower defensive countermeasures.
    What can he give Ning that Ning wouldn't be able to just get himself if he wanted it?

    The novel has already specifically said that 1 persons heartforce blocks another's unless they don't want it to. It isn't like an invisibility suit. It is like my analogy.
    He blocks their view in whatever area he can manage. They can't see what is within Ning range but they can see that a certain area is blocking their Heartforce.

    I thought he could hide from heartforce as well with his Evasion stance, or what that him blocking someone else's heartforce and uses his evasion technique to become invisible to other senses?

    I never said that Ning and Redwater would do the same thing, I said if they did they would be guilty of everything I'm accusing Solesky of.
    Ning and Ninedust are good friends because in the past they have made deals and agreement not Life binding and even with the allure of rare treasure they did not stab eachother in the back.
    They made a deal that they would all fight equally for the seal and they wouldnt kill eachother. The author said that in this context. Friendship wouldn't stop them from competing over the seal but it ended at that, afterwards it went to the lucky guy who got.
    How is that fighting for it over friendship but giving up friendship, half of what you said doesn't even make sense.



    Solesky is weak, the author has already stated that he is weak. It has been confirmed for us. He was a 3rd Tier Daolord who became an Emperor.
    He is only as strong as a Supreme Daolord. Ning and Winesage are already even beyond that. Solesky is weak, there is no debate on this. In comparison to Ning, he is weak.


    Edit: @VinnyOni1 You should break up your thought with new paragraphs. When you are replying to a different point start a new paragraph. It makes your posts easier to read and respond to. Your last one was just a mass of messy text. Just some honest advice.
     
    Last edited: Oct 1, 2017
  9. AardwarkThe2nd

    AardwarkThe2nd (R-18 writer) Aardwark, the king of aardvarks!

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    Yeah, Solesky can get treasures. But are those treasures useful to Ji Ning? What Ji Ning needs are Hegemon Dao seals and comparable treasures. Can Solesky get them for Ning? As I said earlier, Hegemon legacies don't hand out their treasures to Eternal Emperors who have already solidified their path. They forbid Eternal Emperors from entering.
    Yeah, author has repeatedly said that Solesky has only his defensive Aquaform to make him rise to the level of decent Eternal Emperors who won't be killed by crazy Verge failed Daolords.
    He failed to fuse a Supreme Dao. Ji Ning's competitors and Ninedust have fused 2+ Supreme Daos. Ji Ning fights the top 20 Daolords, all the rest are trash out of the picture. So Solesky was trash.
    And of course, Ji Ning is the MC. He can get top kek treasures and we can believe it. But trash Solesky getting treasures that will be able to fulfil the debt he owes to Ji Ning? Hahaha.
    The Alchemy Hegemon was guarding her brother's legacy from trash Eternal Emperors from stealing the treasures. The Eternal Emperor was getting insight into the Prime Essences of the universe, not stealing from the dead Hegemon's treasure troves.
     
  10. VinnyOni1

    VinnyOni1 Well-Known Member

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    The novel has also shown that heartforce is more flexible than that. Heartforce blocked off Ning view of an entire floor level. But you are saying if Ning couldn't use it to hide himself from heartforce so it brushed pass him. Think of it like this, he is using the detection ability (which is what they'd use to find him) of his heartforce to hide from them. Heartforce isn't like a wall, where if you block something the other person knows off the bat. It is more devious than that. Described as ephemeral in the story. Now if the opponents heartforce was vastly stronger than his (like it was before) than yes they would automatically detect something was up, but remember he upgraded his heartforce mid fight.

    And yeah I typed first and edited later. You probably saw it before the edits.

    About the treasure think of it like this, as an Elder God Ning obtain a treasure that Daolord would be envious of (the beads that allowed him to create that seal that transforms his energy). It's a matter of luck and fate. So it isn't dependent on power. Which means Solesky could just as well find one as well. And because he said he owed Ning, the author will make it so just that happens.
    ^Statement about the strenght of the Vastheaven Palace. And remember all three daolords at that time were of similar strength. Of course now Ning is the strongest Daolord. Once again Solesky isn't eak, you all are saying because he couldn't fight against the top 20 he is weak. That's like saying because I can't against a martial arts master I am weak. As a daolord in comparison to the top 10 in ranking he is weak, in comparison will all Daolord he is strong.
     
    Last edited: Oct 1, 2017
  11. Viola

    Viola Studio Ghibli Fanboy Mother of Learning Fanboy

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    Sorry the novel has already stated that Heartforce works in the way I have described. It is possible it may work like you think in the future but it hasn't yet. Doesn't matter how Heartforce is describe it matters how it has been used.
    My way has been shown, yours hasnt. As of right now I am right and you are not. Heartforce in this scenario works in the way I described. Sorry.
    Quote to prove me wrong and if you can't find a quote showing Heartforce can make Ning invisible without outright blocking others heartforce then stop, just stop.
    I'm open to being proven wrong but saying heart force has been described as ephemeral doesn't prove that it works in the way you want. Quote me an example.
    Remember these are their Heart Force world's projection they are using to detect eachother. There is your hint.

    If Solesky has enough Karmic Luck to find a crazy OP item he could use to repay Ning then okay, that would work.
    But that also isn't what I'm talking about. Barring random ass luck what can Solesky actively do or search for that Ning can't do or search for on his own? Nothing.

    Another idea for this debt just popped up into my head. What if Ning asks Solesky to find Maiden Nuwa for him. That would be a good repayment for debt.
    Bypasses this whole treasure hunting talk and allows Ning to train while having Nuwa searched for.
     
  12. VinnyOni1

    VinnyOni1 Well-Known Member

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    How about I prove you wrong at the core. You're point is that he couldn't have gotten away using heartforce plus his evasion technique because his heartforce would be detected and they would know his location. Then how about this, heartforce can cover an entire realm. If two people's heartforce are of equal level than they cancel each out so that you can't scan that location (a realm of space). If Ning used his heartforce and Winesage also tried to use it, it would have cancelled out.

    Unless you are saying Winesage could pinpoint his location in a realm of space when he can't detect him via heartforce, godsense and the rest than my original point that he could have escaped, if not for the author wanting to make plot, still stands. Honestly I still don't understand why people are going on like Solesky killed Ning's family and must pay with a lifetime of servitude or something equivalent

    And I guess if you hide something from heartforce it leaves a void... sort of like how all those seals were hidden from heartforce and everyone with heartforce was able to notice?(Those seals sure did stand out like a kid running around with a blanket on) you did say that blocking heartforce does that right? Leaves a noticeable hole. Sorry, heartforce doesn't work like that. I'm just using logic to determine that you can hide something from heartforce and not leave a "gaping hole" in space that will be noticable. And it's too much work to stroll through all the chapters about heartforce just to prove you wrong on a point that wasn't even the main point. You'll read about it when they mention heartforce in later chapters.
    Last bit, I missed part of what you said. I was saying how is that they would fight over the seal for friendship but still give it up (for the sake of or because of feelings of friendship). People are saying if he was a true friend he would have gave up the seal and not used it.
     
    Last edited: Oct 1, 2017
  13. Viola

    Viola Studio Ghibli Fanboy Mother of Learning Fanboy

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    How about you prove me wrong with reference to what i actually said instead of what you think i said.
    You are saying that i am saying he couldn't have gotten away using heartforce plus his evasion technique. That's is not my point, that's the point you think i am making.
    Before I asked you if his evasion technique allowed him to hide from heartforce, you didn't answer me. I thought his evasion technique was enough for him to get away on its own, my first point was that Heartforce wouldn't do the job you were saying it would and that The Shadowless stance was more than capable of doing it all. The Shadowless stance should hide him from everything perhaps barring the sense of an extremely powerful cultivator like a Hegemon or something.
    Absence of information is in itself information. If their senses are being blocked in a certain area then they can infer that Ning would be somewhere in that area.
    Their Heart worlds would have only clashed and cancelled each other out if that was what they wanted to do. They can passively watch as long as no one is trying to suppress the other or prevent them from seeing anything.

    Again, i think that if Ning used his shadowless stance he would be undetectable but i was arguing from the point that his shadowless stance can be seen by heartforce so he would have to use other methods. I was arguing against you, saying that heartforce wouldn't work in hiding him from Winesage or any other Heartforce cultivator who is near the same level as him.
    Correct me if i am wrong but you were saying that Ning could use heartforce to seamlessly hide from other heartforce like he had an invisibility cloak. That is what i was arguing against.

    You like Solesky, me and others do not.
    I did not equate this to Solesky killing Ning's family or something equivalent.
    My idea was for him to guard The three Realms, i never said it was a lifetime of servitude or even something equivalent. Afterwards i even came up with the idea of him searching for Nuwa.

    If you try fighting heartforce with heartforce yes. When Ning and them were all searching for the seal he used his heartforce to make it so people couldn't see what was going on. Everyone knew Ning was in there but couldn't see what was happening which is why they didn't know Solesky had the seal. So yes it does leave a void when you try to sense an area that someone with equally strong heartforce is trying to block.

    Those seals were not hidden in the wave-shift realm by heartforce. They were in-cased in something that blocked any sensing of it.

    "It's too much work so I'm not going to prove you wrong." Dude, why would anyone believe you then?
    I am open to being proven wrong and learning more. But saying ill be proven wrong in the future means jack all. We don't discuss spoilers here and any ideas or theories i make are all based off of non-spoiler knowledge. So either there is something already translated that explicitly proves me wrong, there isn't anything and i am right or there is something but it is considered spoilers.
    If you don't want to show me what is supporting your facts and proves me wrong that's fine, no one can force you to back up your own points.
    I at least give examples to strengthen my viewpoints and even quote when i know where it exactly states it.



    During our debate here you have put words in my mouth and misrepresented my points more than once without acknowledging it or correcting yourself even when i called you out.
    If you say i misrepresented you i will change my argument or my view based on what you really meant. I will set the record straight so people know my true opinion and so I'm not arguing against a point someone didn't even make.
    I am all for these debates and fun arguments but i wont do it with people who misrepresent me or put words in my mouth. Whether you are doing this intentionally or unintentionally address it or its done.
    You call me out, ill address it, not ignore you.
     
  14. VinnyOni1

    VinnyOni1 Well-Known Member

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    That's a quote from saying that Shadowless is better than heartforce in hiding people. Why would Ning let them passively watch him? of course he would cancel them out in And my point is that you all are equating the level of *punishment* to what it would be if he had killed his family. Just because you say find Nuwa doesn't mean you didn't say protect his realm. And since you didn't say for how long. So am I to assume you meant protect his realm for a hundred years? Anyway this dead, the characters have moved on and I think it's time you did too.
    I'm not responding to some of your stuff becauseI feel you are not receptive to the information. If I say something twice and twice you twist what I say or conveniently misinterpret why would I say it a third time? I'll end it here.
     
    Last edited: Oct 1, 2017
  15. Viola

    Viola Studio Ghibli Fanboy Mother of Learning Fanboy

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    Yes that is my quote. I did say that. That wasnt a quote from the novel. I was arguing from the view that shadowless could not hide from heartforce even though I thought and still do think that Shadowless can hide from heartforce. Thats why we got into that heartforce debate.

    Here is an idea, don't assume you know what others meant. That a good rule.
    But I'll just clarify incase. I don't think Solesky deserves eternal servitude.

    Way to take the high ground after mis-representing my views and putting words in my mouth.
    You rock man.
    We are done.
     
  16. peekingpanda

    peekingpanda Active Member

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    but who knows. Maybe solesky gets one of the 4 remaining treasures that fuels his northbow swords to evolve and gifts them to ning? And plus he and redwater are both water dao specialists. Perhaps solesky has something that ninedust can find useful stashed somewhere or knows of a water based daomerge treasure that he himself couldnt grab due to weakness?.
     
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  17. Viola

    Viola Studio Ghibli Fanboy Mother of Learning Fanboy

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    I can say you aren't receptive to the information too. It is a matter of perspective and opinion.

    I missed your edit. So in the future if you think I have twisted what you said or misrepresented you, speak up.
    I can't correct it or address it if you don't tell me you think I've mis-represented you or took what you say out of context. How can I fix that issue if you don't tell me about it.

    I tried telling you about it when you did it to me but you ignored it and wouldn't address it all.
    The only way to avoid that and correct it is to bring it up and address it.
    That goes for both of us.
     
  18. MangoGuy

    MangoGuy Rambling Mango

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    “My skills lie in the Dao of Numerancy, not in battle,” Daolord Badlands said calmly. “If I chose to go into hiding, you wouldn’t even be able to find me, Ninedust.”

    There...Some aquaforms can also be burnt.
     
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  19. Sena

    Sena Well-Known Member

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    Are some people really having a hard time imagining how a defence-focused Eternal Emperor could manage to find treasures?

    Even if Solesky's offensive power is weak, it's still going to be above all but the most supreme of Daolords, and his defensive abilities are above most supreme Daolords. The story already has plenty of examples of second-tier Daolords (or weaker) stumbling onto amazing treasures in the Terror Starsea and other dangerous areas (they aren't all legacies that are intentionally left behind for people below a certain power level); there are places like that with treasures just lying around for people to find, the problem is that it's risky to explore those places. Finding treasures is easy, the problem is surviving. Solesky can safely go places that Ning can't, he can explore the Terror Starsea, the Great Dark, or other dangerous places with minimal risk. As time goes on, he'll naturally amass more valuable treasures than any Daolord (excluding the protagonist of course) will be capable of.
     
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  20. VinnyOni1

    VinnyOni1 Well-Known Member

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    I agree, someone strong may die in the great dark but someone with strong defensive skills-evasive skills would have a greater chance of surviving and keeping the treasures. Waveshift for example. Or the space-time hegemon. There were plenty of instances where Ning was able to obtain treasures and survive because of his defensive skills and not his attack power. (Without the hegemon armor he would be dead already).