Chinese supreme?!?!?

Discussion in 'Novel General' started by ImperialNero, May 3, 2021.

  1. Elementarteilchen

    Elementarteilchen Well-Known Member

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    Really? It was ages ago, that I saw the Avenger movies. Could you give me an example? I can't imagine marvel would do such a thing. F.e. in Black Panther the state Wakanda is in Africa and the names of the population sound like african names (T'Challa, N'Jadaka, M'Baku, W'Kabi etc.)
    Also the upcoming new marvel movie plays in china, but the chinese people don't have american names, right? F.e. the protagonist is called Shang-Chi.
    I'm not a huge fan of superhero movies or marvel in general, so my knowledge is very limited in this regard.
    I can just give a few examples.
     
    Last edited: May 4, 2021
  2. Molen

    Molen Well-Known Member

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    The fact that he call himself Black Panther instead of an african names is an example, if he really is a hero from wakanda, why doesnt he call himself with an african name?

    If i am not wrong, marvel and dc tried to "include" a lot of different culture just a few years ago. Try to read old comic book that have foreign heroes and list their names

    It is very hard to create a name based on a culture that you really dont know about because you need to at the very least have minimal understanding of that specific culture and/or language to create a name that actually make sense in that culture/language. If someone tried to create a name inspired from a culture that person doesnt really know, it will be like a machine translated name, that sometimes might be slightly offensife/inappropiate (there was a real world example, a beverage name in UK that was named spunk or something, i forgot the details). Sometimes it is easier to just create name from something that you are really familiar with.

    Or, he might really want to cater to his local audience
     
  3. Elementarteilchen

    Elementarteilchen Well-Known Member

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    But isn't this a different thing? It is just a title. His name is T'Challa, but I'll give you that point. What about all the other citizens? They all have african names and this is the difference. They don't have all american names.
     
    Last edited: May 4, 2021
  4. Molen

    Molen Well-Known Member

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    According to wikipedia "Thousands of years ago, five African tribes war over a meteorite containing the metal vibranium. One warrior ingests a "heart-shaped herb" affected by the metal and gains superhuman abilities, becoming the first "Black Panther". He unites all but the Jabari Tribe to form the nation of Wakanda"

    It means that black panther does have an african name, since the title exist since thousands of years. Then, why he doesnt call himself with the african name then?

    Because the writer doesnt really think of that at the moment of black panther creation, and marvel is based on US, which means the writer might cater to the US market first, where the people might not be that familiar with african names.

    About the other citizens, if i am not wrong they were retconed later to fleshed out black panther backstory. Might be wrong though, try asking other people that have more knowledge in comics.
     
  5. Nightow1

    Nightow1 Well-Known Member

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    You do know that all those are fake African names? Not everything with an apostrophe is African. It's like calling a European "Buggabuggabungabunga". It isn't a real name and is more nonsensical than anything else. By the way, T'Challa is an African corruption of an English word, Teacher.

    Actually those are fake African names, they added in an apostrophe to words to make it look "African".

    I mean take a look here and see how many apostrophes you see in real African names.
    https://www.behindthename.com/names/usage/african
     
  6. Elementarteilchen

    Elementarteilchen Well-Known Member

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    I just mentioned some african citizens, that were in the movie. I don't have any idea about comics though :D

    No, I didn't know. They just sound like african names to me and rightfully so.
    I just used google and some names are real african names, like Ayo and Zuri and without the prefix (N'Jadaka=Jadaka), some are real african names.
    Yeah, it's pretty much a mix of fantasy and african names, probably to better portray and differentiate the fictional state of Wakanda in africa and the marvel universe.

    https://www.thecsnetwork.co.uk/post/names-of-wakandan-people
     
    Last edited: May 4, 2021
  7. Sai55

    Sai55 Member

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    That's why I stay away from Urban Fantasy or anything similar to it. First of all Modern World + Magic doesn't fix well in the first place. But the more important reason is authors will insert "My City innocent", "My Country better" etc, etc.

    I mean look at Solo Levelling. "Me country innocent, best and most righteous. Everyone else bad".

    The novel Record of Human Emperor, while not in a modern or futuristic world, is in alternate ancient China. Needless to say, most bad reviews just say it's crap cuz it has the "Me country best, innocent, the only righteous place".

    So I have learned to stay away from anything that connects to our world, except the "Crack System" types, they generally avoid this annoying "Me country best" thing. Well, at least the ones I read are good.

    Well not like I can escape the trope, cuz we will still find "My Sect best", "My Guild best" in complete fantasy settings in CN, JP, and KR novels. But they are much more tolerable.
     
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  8. Nightow1

    Nightow1 Well-Known Member

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    And we did touch on the difficulty of making sense of a different language and culture. I mean, if Chinese can have a dish name properly translated as "Fucked until exploded duck", which is actually a "correct" translation, trying to make up different cultural names randomly can be a disaster lol. Especially in Asian languages where the same "word" can have many different meanings. Can you imagine a character whose name is a homonym of "Meat Toilet"? :ROFLMAO:
     
  9. SylviaViolet

    SylviaViolet 『Sylvian』『Pirate Engineer』⚓️

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    I am a supporter of letting some things stay the same but let's be reasonable here, no one is asking for names and stuff to be completely translated.
     
  10. Nightow1

    Nightow1 Well-Known Member

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    I mean untranslated. Authors that don't know the other language can sometimes end up with name combos that... should be best left alone. lol.
     
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  11. ToastedRossi

    ToastedRossi Well-Known Member

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    The old adage is "write what you know" so I don't think this phenomenon has anything to do with cultural supremacy. More likely it's either a case of the writer just never thinking the matter through and just put Chinese names on everyone or that he hasn't researched non-Chinese names and so he's not comfortable with using them. Sure it's not the ideal way to do things but it can be better than the alternative.

    I'm also curious as to how Chinese these names are to begin with. If they don't have Chinese-styled surnames and the like it can be pretty easy to mistaken non-Chinese names for Chinese ones. For example, most Japanese names use kanji which means that they can be transcribed and romanized like Chinese names if the translator isn't careful about it.

    Yeah, this is a huge problem when writers don't put enough work into researching names. The Shang-Chi example brought up earlier is a great illustration of this. Marvel originally had him as the son of Fu Manchu, which is so problematic that they try to pretend it never happened. Even so, the name itself doesn't really work in Chinese and there are tons of people making fun of it.
     
  12. Nightow1

    Nightow1 Well-Known Member

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    The closest I can think of to a translation of his name is "Shang Chai" or "Serve the dishes!" lol. Something you tell waiters to do.

    Edit: ......
    Wait, if his family name is Fu and his name is Shang Chi, then isn't his full name Fu Shang Chi? Or ... Cart Him Up/Lift Him Up? ROFL!!!!
     
    Last edited: May 7, 2021