Question Quick Question Concerning Rules

Discussion in 'Translator's Corner' started by ShyHeaux, Oct 23, 2021.

  1. ShyHeaux

    ShyHeaux Member

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2021
    Messages:
    34
    Likes Received:
    25
    Reading List:
    Link
    I hope this is the right place to post this. I recently picked up a project from the "Novel Pickup Request" forum, added the series to the site, and posted the first chapter yesterday. I was contacted by someone, I don't know who the group is because they didn't say, but they basically told me that they were working on translating this novel and were going to post their chapters here anyways. Can they actually do that? I tried to see if they wanted to collaborate instead but they said no. I feel like I may have no choice but to drop it, but I wanted to know if this can happen again if I pick up a new novel to translate. I read the rules but I'm not sure how I apply it to my situation.
     
  2. LaDyViL

    LaDyViL New Member Staff Member

    Joined:
    Nov 9, 2015
    Messages:
    9,638
    Likes Received:
    22,604
    Reading List:
    Link
    First I'd like you to understand that NU is a public space. If your translations comply with its policy, your chapters will be listed.

    That policy is originally made to prevent poachers but as with poachers, NU also does not entertain hoggers unless they can fulfill all the requirements stated in the policy. This person that contacted you can't prevent you from getting your chapters listed on NU.

    However, there's a set of translator etiquette that I am not familiar with where some people can "claim" the novel while not making it known to others outside of their circle. Some translators have their own circle where if you don't know information shared in it then you're in the wrong for not knowing.

    At the end of the day it's up to you what you'll decide. As far as NU is concerned you can list your translations as long as it complies to NU policy.

    Edit: NU Policy (https://www.novelupdates.com/nu-policy/)
     
    Last edited: Oct 23, 2021
  3. Nightow1

    Nightow1 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 22, 2019
    Messages:
    2,266
    Likes Received:
    2,716
    Reading List:
    Link
    From what I can see, if you are talking about the "Obsessed" novel, the other guy only had one release 3 months ago, so there really is a case that he might be hogging. I mean, 1 chapter 3 months ago isn't that productive and it means that 4 chapters will take a year to release. His links are also to a dead site.
     
  4. TDDM

    TDDM Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 7, 2017
    Messages:
    270
    Likes Received:
    259
    Reading List:
    Link
    In that kind of situation, I would ask them if they have legal rights (From the author) to translate if not just ignore them.
     
    Nightow1 and LaDyViL like this.
  5. ShyHeaux

    ShyHeaux Member

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2021
    Messages:
    34
    Likes Received:
    25
    Reading List:
    Link
    It was for Dilettante. There were no previous translators because it's a new addition on NU. I decided to drop the novel because I don't want to fight or compete over a novel.
     
  6. runsing

    runsing status : bleeding, health -10/s Novel Updates Staff

    Joined:
    Nov 4, 2015
    Messages:
    3,064
    Likes Received:
    6,389
    Reading List:
    Link
    you're barely starting. even when you already have a significant amount of chapters translated, anybody can still submits their own, as long as pre-requisites are met (click the link below).
    https://www.novelupdates.com/nu-policy/

    though, why stop for someone who's apparently "claimed to be in the middle of doing it". i mean, why you really need to care for something's that who knows if its even real. you do your stuff. they do theirs.

    "we are translating it privately in our tiny, closed circle, for paying readers only, so you can't be translating the same stuff as us" is the biggest, smelliest bullshit that's been around forever.
     
    Cooltela, Blitz, Parth37955 and 7 others like this.
  7. IceLight303

    IceLight303 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2018
    Messages:
    1,284
    Likes Received:
    1,428
    Reading List:
    Link
    Sounds like a person is just claiming it. Unless they have permission from the author, then you have just as much claim as them to the novel. I wouldn't stop translating just because they may be in the middle of translating but in reality they haven't started or don't end up uploading chapters.
    So here is my recommendation keep translating and uploading. They might first try to upload chapters over you/ fight with you. However if they are hogging novels then they won't be able to keep up and will drop the series. I know you don't want to fight for the novel but there is nothing stopping others from picking up a novel that is already being worked on or is complete. So you could encounter this situation in the future.
     
    Nightow1, Westeller and runsing like this.
  8. ShyHeaux

    ShyHeaux Member

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2021
    Messages:
    34
    Likes Received:
    25
    Reading List:
    Link
    Because I'm mostly MTL, my Korean isn't past conversational level to completely rely on my own efforts. They said their translation is better than mine so I don't want to compete over it. I didn't want to feel bad about my translation. I did have my dad (who is Korean) scan over the chapter and he said the general idea and events were being translated. I'm new at this, so I didn't know what to think to the message.

    They said I made numerous mistakes and that they didn't make the same mistakes and were better equipped to translate the novel in the way that conveyed the author's intent and nuances with 2 additional native Korean translators. I saw they are apart of Foxholic and thought maybe with that big community, perhaps they will post more than my intended 4 chapters a month.

    I do feel bad because someone did reach out and provide me with 10 chapters of the raws, but I don't want the drama. I'll most likely just translate those chapters for them to have.
     
  9. runsing

    runsing status : bleeding, health -10/s Novel Updates Staff

    Joined:
    Nov 4, 2015
    Messages:
    3,064
    Likes Received:
    6,389
    Reading List:
    Link
    again, 'they said'.

    so what if 'they said'. everybody has to start somewhere.
     
    Westeller likes this.
  10. LaDyViL

    LaDyViL New Member Staff Member

    Joined:
    Nov 9, 2015
    Messages:
    9,638
    Likes Received:
    22,604
    Reading List:
    Link
    I'd like to reiterate that NU does not support hoggers unless they can fulfill the policy as shown in the link posted before. If you want to post your translation links on NU, that is your choice. You asked whether they can do that, the answer is Yes they can tell you not to post but NO they can't decide what NU will list or not list on Novel Updates.

    Novel Updates is not related to any translation groups whether they're official translation or fan translation. Whether it's a big community or a small community, as long as the link and content comply with NU policy they'll be accepted.

    I'm a bit curious which translator had the gall to comment on other translator's quality and claimed they're better when they haven't published any chapters yet. NU lists even shit quality translations and there's lots of those on the site. Even Foxaholic has low quality translations. A huge community doesn't guarantee speedy and high quality chapters.
     
    Blitz, Westeller, Solus and 1 other person like this.
  11. IceLight303

    IceLight303 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2018
    Messages:
    1,284
    Likes Received:
    1,428
    Reading List:
    Link
    Foxholic is a pretty casual group. They have dropped a lot of series so I wouldn't take their words to heart. As for the drama, you can't avoid it if your going to translate.
    For example I was an editor for a friend who was translating a series. They are native Chinese and I am a native English speaker. There were a lot of comments about how the Chinese wasn't interpreted right and the author's meaning wasn't getting across. Or that the English didn't make sense, and that's not how to a native English speaker would say it. Another was at that updates with you slow, even though the series has been updated 4 times a week, which is pretty quick for most translations, the chapters are fairly long as well. People are going to leave rude and mean comments. Don't get me wrong, there will be more positive comments and there will be negative. So you might avoid the drama with this translator but you won't be able to avoid all the drama.

    Right? Unfortunately, this isn't the first time I've heard of other translators insulting and criticizing new translators or other translators work. I would understand if they were already working on the series, as in had released and were consistent. Then okay ask the new translator to stop but to insult them is not okay. This gets me angry.
    (•ˋ _ ˊ•)
     
  12. ShyHeaux

    ShyHeaux Member

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2021
    Messages:
    34
    Likes Received:
    25
    Reading List:
    Link
    This is true, but they made me feel so bad that I don't even want to keep translating the novel anymore.

    The thing was they didn't come across rude so I honestly felt I was doing something wrong. They gave me a list of examples of what I got wrong, and said it was only a small sample.
     
  13. IceLight303

    IceLight303 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2018
    Messages:
    1,284
    Likes Received:
    1,428
    Reading List:
    Link
    They may not have intended to be rude or sounded rude but they are being rude.
    There are a few tactics that people who hog novels by claiming them use.
    1: They just tell the person who picked it up that they claimed the title and hope they will drop it.
    2: send messages constantly to get them to stop updating.
    3: say that the quality is bad
    4: say they are in the middle of stockpiling chapters
    5: lie about having an agreement with the author (this is hard to prove so you have to take their word most of the time, or risk getting DMCA take down notice)
    These are the ones that I can think of at the moment.
    Unless they haven't permission with the original author or the original publisher, they can't stop you. The only thing they can do is make things difficult for you and make you feel bad with hopes that you stop translating and drop the series.
     
  14. yelim0503

    yelim0503 New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2021
    Messages:
    7
    Likes Received:
    10
    Reading List:
    Link
    Hello, I'm the person who contacted ShyHeaux.

    I actually didn't tell them to give up--nor did I say I was hoarding or claiming the chapters. I actually messaged to let them know that we (me and my co-tls) had a few chapters translated, and if they would mind if we posted what we translated anyway (because I didn't want waste our efforts and there were translation differences). We repeatedly said that we had no desire to push you out of the project. I said that there's merit to well-edited MTL, and that I definitely DID NOT want you to delete your chapters because that'd waste your time and effort.

    In fact, I said, at the end of my messages, that if you'd feel better with us not posting the translated chapters, we'd be happier backing off since we wanted no conflict. Please don't feel like you have to be pushed off this project, because that wasn't our intent. (edit grammar)
     
    Last edited: Oct 23, 2021
    Nightow1, runsing and Westeller like this.
  15. ShyHeaux

    ShyHeaux Member

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2021
    Messages:
    34
    Likes Received:
    25
    Reading List:
    Link
    The thing was they didn't come across rude so I honestly felt I was doing something wrong. They gave me a list of examples of what I got wrong, and said it was only a small sample. I didn't think anyone would want to read my translation if there was a non-mtl version available, especially if it was bad.
    Yes, you did ask me not to drop the series towards the end of the conversation... The entire time you made it seem like you were already working on this series and that my translation was subpar, with clear examples and how you could translate in a way that conveyed the author's intentions and nuances.

    I also dropped the series so there shouldn't be any issues or drama. I didn't mention your name or anything for that purpose. I was only asking for advice on the rules so I could understand what decisions to make next time.
     
  16. yelim0503

    yelim0503 New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2021
    Messages:
    7
    Likes Received:
    10
    Reading List:
    Link
    Let's please return this conversation to DMs. You've asked where our translation differences were, so I gave you some (Nor was I saying that your translation was bad). That was in no shape or form a plea for you to stop translating, especially since neither of us own the novel and have no rights to it either. As I've stated early on, it was never my wish for you to stop translating. And, rather, I feel bad that it's come to this. I also posted so as to say that Foxaholic, as a group, has little to do with this and is more an issue (though I hope not an issue for long) between us. I hope, if you have the desire to translate this novel further, that you will continue.
     
    Last edited: Oct 23, 2021
    Westeller likes this.
  17. ShyHeaux

    ShyHeaux Member

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2021
    Messages:
    34
    Likes Received:
    25
    Reading List:
    Link
    I also dropped the series so there shouldn't be any issues or drama. I didn't mention your name or anything for that purpose. I was only asking for advice on the rules so I could understand what decisions to make ne
    Yes, it's natural to ask what was incorrect when told something is incorrect. You said your group wanted the novel to be presented correctly from the perspective of a native speaker since mtl will miss many of those while pointing out that my translation did just that.
    There really isn't anything to talk about as I already told you I dropped the novel.
     
  18. IceLight303

    IceLight303 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2018
    Messages:
    1,284
    Likes Received:
    1,428
    Reading List:
    Link
    So you messaged then not hoping they would drop the novel? What was the point of the message, to tell them their translation had some inaccuracies? Then at some point you mention that you and your team were planning on working on it?

    They most likely felt attacked. If you plan on translating your going to have to learn to brush off negative comments.
     
  19. yelim0503

    yelim0503 New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2021
    Messages:
    7
    Likes Received:
    10
    Reading List:
    Link
    We had three chapters (3rd chapter finished, other two getting there) that we had worked on. So I was hoping to get permission (or at least acknowledgement that this wouldn't blindside them) to post those chapters so it wouldn't feel like work was going to waste. I mentioned that there were some mistranslations in hers, (for example, the MC's name was changed into a word, Driver became knight, chainsmoker became scumbag, and late-bloomer became (time) late...mistakes from mtl stuff). But, I mentioned it so that they knew the chapters aren't a total duplication--there's differences. We didn't initially say these mistranslations in detail in the first message and only expanded when they asked what the differences were. Honestly, like I said in my messages, we thought ShyHeaux would do their own thing disregarding us, and we would have been fine with that. In fact, I pretty much begged in my messages for them to not let these chapters change anything (or if it did, tell us to not post them) and to not drop the novel.

    EDIT: tldr - our main intent was to avoid drama.
     
    Nightow1 and DjB1 like this.
  20. Nightow1

    Nightow1 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 22, 2019
    Messages:
    2,266
    Likes Received:
    2,716
    Reading List:
    Link
    Why don't we just post everything out. If she wants to continue, then she will, just toss out whatever you have first so that you won't be in a situation of "we did not publish anything but we're translating this novel in theory".

    There is nothing wrong with 2 translations, even translations of the same novel will have differences due to different translator mindsets and degree of rigour when it comes to word for word changes. It just depends on who the reader is more comfortable with.
     
    IceLight303 and runsing like this.